Official Luthiers Forum!

The trick is to keep that build list as well as your price list growing, good luck!!

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Tickle your guitar daily, and it'll tickle you back.

All good advice here Brock, these are the basic tools that I have used for the most part and they do work.

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Tickle your guitar daily, and it'll tickle you back.

I commonly repeat this very important point -- beware of your own ego. Why is it that ALL of us always think our instruments are pretty good, then years later look back and think, "Man, I sure had a long way to go!". It is human nature to be proud of one's own labor and that pride can blind us from looking objectively at our work.

As other's have mentioned, unless you are unnaturally gifted in fine woodworking -- your first few instruments will absolutely be sup-par in many respects. I personally believe that you want a killer product before you start marketing your work. I also wish I had waited a bit longer before I started working with dealers because I think some of my early "professional" guitars were ugly. Regardless, I was objective with myself enough to realize that my work needed a lot of artistic improvement as well as figuring out what I wanted my instruments to sound like -- because of this, I purposely stayed under the radar for a few years trying to really refine my product.

I think the smartest advice is to just build for material costs + a little extra for shop expenses - that way you won't be losing anything other than your time.

And lastly, all of wish you the very best of luck. This forum is a great place to look for help and advice on your path to building great instruments!!!

--
Simon

As far as getting your name out there, I'm thinking of starting to advertise in Acoustic Guitar or The Fretboard Journal -- for people who have done this, was it worth the cost?

-Mike

define "worth it."

Do you mean will you get enough orders to cover the cost of the ad? (That seems to be what most builders mean when they say "worth it"). If that is what you mean.. not even close. Advertising is an "awareness" tool not a sales tool.

If you are looking for a tool to help get your "name out there" and in the rarified air of other big name builders... then yes, it is worth it.

Personally though I would put a lot more energy into the other channels before you run ads in national magazines.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

There is a BIG difference from Hobby builder , to selling professionally . I am going to play devil's advocate here and pass on some advice. If you built less than 10 guitars, you most likely are not ready . It isn't easy to sell successfully. How and what kind of warranty are you planning on giving with the guitar. The business side will mean that the dealer will also need a piece of the action so plan 20 to 30% for the seller .
I feel , if you think you have a sellable product hit a few shows , and see what the public thinks about your wares. This is a serious step to make . The Reality is that it takes time to build a customer base . What you think the public likes may not be what it is . I don't want to sound discouraging but for the few builders that make it in this business , it can be very good. For the most part many start and few succeed . I do wish you well but the fact is ,it is a very hard market .

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John Hall
blues creek guitars
Authorized CF Martin Repair
Co President of ASIA
You Don't know what you don't know until you know it

" I have no problem with all the advise given - but what do you do with the first 10, 20 or 40 ? I have no room in my house to hang them all up. At least I wouldn't be permitted.
Should they be given away ?"

Operation happy note. a group of people that hooks military personel up with musical instuments. You could send them to guys and gals who could play them and pass them on. Possible future customers. They need donations for money for postage and shipping material, they take instruments also.
Bill

I've finished and gave away three. I have three more on the "give away" list. My original thinking was that by the time I finish the "give away" list I would be able to build myself a descent guitar which is the reason I started building in the first place. Along the way I have had friend tell me they would like to buy one. I am afraid to sell one because then my hobby/passion will have a totally different dimension to it...ie.. it is now a transaction where I am selling what I enjoy so much. I'm afraid it will change the love I have for building to a business. But on the other hand I would like to have some $ to buy some tools and maybe some wood So what I plan to do is build three or so and let whoever wants to buy one pick. Take it home and play it for a while. If they want to keep it then make me an offer. If they don't want it no problem. The idea is I will take exactly what they offer and it is done.

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Mark Ewing
Columbus Ohio
"Trees are an important and precious thing. We should build good things with them. Building good guitars with heart are the best use for them." K. Yairi.

Speaking from my own experience - I wouldn't give the first few guitars out of my own hands (maybe on a loan basis to good friends).

When I completed and strung up my first steel string guitar a year ago or so, I was all hyped up - it looked great (yeah...ok, it had a few minor beauty marks ) and it was the best sounding guitar I had played so far (I never played a hand made instrument before though).

Recently, I noticed that the sound started to deteriorate. I had a closer look, and the bridge is starting to come loose. Also, the neck is already (way to early) showing the first signs of 180lbs of constant tension.

Now all this is stuff that didn't show in the first few months of playing the guitar, so the mistakes I made may be in the instrument I have started since - I'll probably find out a year from now or so. So until I really know that I have the process down to repeatedly make guitars that look, play, and sound as good after one or two years, as they did after the first few weeks of playing, I won't sell. That'll give me lots of time perfecting my skills in making an absolutely even binding channel

Christian

Another anecdote comes to mind. I once knew a guy that was a singer/songwriter. He played around town occasionally, not a lot. But he decided he wanted to make a cd. So he did, and he ordered 1,000 copies of it with artwork and all. This was probably 12 years ago. He had a very hard time selling those copies. After about a year, he'd probably sold a dozen, and given away another hundred.

He created a product for which there was no demand. The desire to make the product, and sell it, came from him, not the other way around.

The time and money spent creating the product which no one wanted could have been spent developing the product into something that someone would.

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"...you have to get over your strict adherence to your largely imagined notion of absolute perfection..."

All good advice. Here's another point to ponder. Do you want to take commissions and have that sword hanging over your head? How much time can you devote to building?

For myself, as a pure hobyist with 12K+ invested in tools and wood, the urge can be pretty strong to want to recuperate my costs. However, when the fanciful ideas hit me about selling, I'm quickly brought back to reality. Building a good guitar takes time. If you have a day job, family, friends, a social life or a property to maintain..etc etc... the list gets pretty long rather quickly. There are only 24 hrs. in a day!

Once you've done a bit of soul searching, have honestly compared your instruments to those of the pros and still want to sell them at a profit, I would suggest building spec guitars. This way, you'll at least save yourself the stress of working under a deadline. Also, as you move along, you'll probably change jigs here and there, fine tune a process or two and you'll be able to ascertain how much time you actually take to build a guitar from A to Z...

Keep a journal! That's probably one of the best tools you'll have. It's only by taking meticulous notes that you'll be able to judge the time and expenses.

I'm finising my 6th guitar, a Cuban Hog 000. It is for myself, of course, because you can never have too many guitars. I will try my hand at building in a batch, the next time around. I will probably give away 2 of them, but then again, I just might keep them too... I have serious seperation issues! LOL

Hope this helps!

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I'd like to be able to prove, just for once, that money wouldn't make me happy...

I've been preparing for retirement and building guitars with the hope of supplementing my income. I built my first acoustic maybe 6 years ago and gave it to my best friend who is a very good guitarist. (overbuilt OM and on the third action set-up.) I have six guitars in progress (plus 3 electrics). I will loan the first three to my friend for a year of critique. The other three will go to other local players for a month or so each in exchange for a critique (I'll develop a form. I'm a bureaucrat in real life) I will keep all my build notes, photos, and critiques to demonstrate growth to future customers. I will evaluate the critiques.

I have taken much of the advice given. I went to the Newport Guitar Festival. A friend at Mandolin Brothers took me to Martin Guitar for a special tour. I went to Collings in Austin. I've been to the Purdue Guitar Workshop. John Mayes. I've watched your DVD's and countless other DVD's.

I am hoping to beat all odds and sell my 8th guitar! That's my plan and I'm stickin' to it!! But, ... well, if someone has a better plan, I'm always willing to be open minded.

Danny R. Little (57yrs old and I might not wait 'til 60 to retire)

One thing that has not been mentioned is considering the old chestnut "Be careful what you ask for you might get it". Suppose your building cohabitates with a day job, wife and family. (As is the case with most of us)
You get good, do the shows, get a little following, and things take off. Can you deal with the stress of a long waiting list, impatient customers, dealing with the inevitable complications, etc. while trying to do justice to your real job and family? It could burn little holes in your stomach.

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It's not what you don't know that hurts you, it's what you do know that's wrong.