Official Luthiers Forum!

Hi all. First let me thank all of you for helping me learn more about this fine craft. I haven't posted too often, but I troll the forum constantly gleaning tips and learning constantly. I have just closed the box on my first; what a great feeling. Anyway, on to the point. I thicknessed all parts of this first guitar using hand-planes. It was a great experience, and I learned a great deal. However, I quickly began lusting after a drum sander, but never could find one that fit the budget. Well, after months of vigilant craigslist viewing, I bought a Performax 16-32 in great shape off a gent for $350. Now I need to figure out the best way to use it. It didn't come with the manual. Is the Jet 16-32 manual the same? What grits of sandpaper to you use to complete the thicknessing process? Finally, for now, have you found a certain brand or type of paper works better than others? I'm really looking forward to using this thing. Thanks in advance for the responses.

Aaron

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Aaron Craig

Aaron:

My best tip is to have patience. If you have a planer use it for most of the stock removal and only sand for thicknessing the last 1/16" or so. I leave 120 grit on mine almost 100% of the time and I buy the pre-cut rolls from Woodworkers, Grizzly, and others. I use it for tops, backs and sides of course, but it is particularly handy for small parts like bridges, head stock veneer, bindings, etc.

It takes a while to get efficient with changing paper, which is not cheap. And, I have taken too big of a bite on occasion, burning the paper and wood. But it is a good tool. Yes the Performax and Jet are virtually the same.

Good Luck

That's what I was looking for. Thanks for the quick reply, and have a great day.

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Aaron Craig

I have tried several kinds of abrasive paper & the one that worked best is
Klingspor 311 YX OC. I use 80 grit most of the time.
If you are sanding oily wood, the paper will clog very quickly. Especially if you try to take off too much in one pass. As Danny said... patience is the key.
I suggest care, if you decide to use a planer to thickness your precious tonewood.
Thin pieces can chatter in the planer & you will end up with very expensive kindling.
If the wood is figured, forget it! As often as not, figured wood will disintegrate in a planer at any thickness under around 1/4".
That's been my experience, anyway.

I don't currently have a planer. I wouldn't mind having one for a few non-guitar related woodworking projects, but for now I will keep honing my hand-plane skills. I rather enjoy using them, it is just tricky to precisely and evenly plane than last little bit of thickness for top, backs, and such, and I think the drum sander will really be helpful for that. Thanks for the recommendation on the sandpaper. I'll look into that.

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Aaron Craig

I keep 80 grit on my 10-20. I often resaw to about .125" then use the sander to take it down to 0.050" to 0.100". Be patient, it will do fine. If you are trying to make a living then that might not be the fastest method. I've had too many blowouts trying to use a planer on wood under 0.150" thick so I don't do that.

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Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

The 16-32 is a great machine for the price (and you got a great price on it!). I used one daily for about 12 years and to my knowledge it's still running in a shared lutherie shop near Boston.

There are some issues and things to learn, though. Run it at the highest feed rate/shallow cuts. Heat build-up is the problem with oily/resinous woods; moving the wood quickly helps keep the temp down. Also, feed wood as close to 45º to the grain direction as you can. Sides and bindings are too long to be skewed so much but run them at the highest angle that fits the table. This helps reduce clogging the paper and removes wood more easily. The final passes should be with the grain to reduce hand sanding. Once I'm within .010" of my final thickness, I like to make 2-4 passes without changing the height setting. This reduces scratches, too.

I buy paper in the "Ready to Cut" version from Klingspor. They are the original suppliers, their paper is reliable and good, the Ready to Cut packaging works well. (And they have conveyor belts for all the Jet/Performax sanders at lower price than Jet dealers.) I have some 36 grit around for horsing a lot of wood off in a hurry -- but things tend to slip on the conveyor belt when using it so be careful. 60 grit is the usual first pass abrasive. 80 grit is the most common grit I use. It takes wood off fairly quickly and the scratches don't take a lot to remove. The expensive blue stuff does a slightly better job on really hard or resinous wood. 120 is usually the finest grit I use on the drum though sometimes I finish with 180. Mostly, the Performax is more of a thickness sander than a final sander - ROS and garnet paper are better for that.

If you can get a pair of conveyor belt guides (ceramic guides that attach to the underside of the table), do it! They'll save money, time, and frustration. They're standard on the bigger machines and should be available on-line or through Supermax, the "new" Performax company.

I used flat and lock washers under the bolts that secure the drum assembly to the base. Without them, which is the way the machine came, the bolts galled the aluminum and made adjusting the drum very difficult. Use nyloc nuts.

Rick, that is very useful advice. Thank you very much.

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Aaron Craig

You got a great deal on your used 16-32. I have had a Performax 16-32 since they first came out with the machine (over 12 years now IIRC). Mine had a 2 1/8" port dust collection hood on it - the newer ones have 4" - but I made a new acrylic hood (see-through!) with a 4" port a while back. BTW, I can make more of these if anyone else needs one (PM me).

Just last week, my conveyor belt finally gave up - a small rip on the edge grew and grew till it flapped around and got in the way. This was the original belt - I've never had to change it in all these years! I found a replacement belt on Amazon - it's a rubbery/plastic thing that seems to work WAY better than the original sandpaper belt.

My machine has two magnetically affixed ceramic belt guides underneath the table. I'd forgotten about them but "found" them again when I changed the belt the other night. Don't the newer machines have these as standard?

I've never had any issues with the motor tripping, or the conveyor belt motor giving up like some have had. I use 80 grit almost exclusively and take 1/8th of a turn (i.e. 1/128") bites at a time, sometimes making multiple passes at the same setting (depending on how much noise the operation makes - you kind of learn how to judge the sound over time).

I'm planning on adding a Grizzly G0527 18" wide belt sander to my armoury soon, but I will keep the Performax around for short/small work, probably with a finer grit belt on it.

Cheers,
Dave F.

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Cambrian Guitars

"There goes Mister Tic-Tac out the back with some bric-brac from the knick-knack rack"

You don't need a planer, just start with 36 grit to take the heavy amounts off then switch 80, then 120 or just smooth out by hand after the 80.

Fred

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Fred Tellier
http://www.fetellierguitars.com
Facebook page http://www.facebook.com/pages/FE-Tellier-Guitars/163451547003866

60 grit for most everything. Then a couple of passes with either 100 or 120.
Link

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Cut to size.....Beat to fit.....Paint to match.