Official Luthiers Forum!

Hi all

I was out in the shop last night drinking a beer and just staring blankly at this for quite a while last night.

Not coming to me.

Filippo: The idea of the neck was to use off-cuts from other guitars. You end up with all these small pieces of beautiful wood and I always thought there should be something to do with them. The design is supposed to be random.

Peter: Do you see an issue with the neck integrity? You have a lot more experience than I. I'd appreciate your thoughts. PS. Just finishing up a Parlour guitar with the Sinker I got from you at the swap meet last year. Looks great and taps awesome.

Thanks again everyone for your thoughts.

Neil

I had the same thought as Peter regarding the structural integrity question but didn't say anything since I wasn't certain. I would think that once you routed the channel for the truss rod and especially if you routed and added CF bars in addition, enough meat will have been removed to potentially cause a problem. The only way I would be confident in multiple small piece lams like that would be if I glued it with epoxy. I could be wrong but it doesn't seem as though it would stand the test of time otherwise. It does look very attractive though. For one of my current builds I made a 7 pc. neck out of Claro, Mesquite, EIR, and Quilted Maple. I'm putting my faith in Fish Glue on this one.

_________________
Bill Hodge


One does not simply, own enough guitars!

For what it's worth, here's my take on things: If you cut the bottom of the heel off and re-align it, you will find that the resulting saw kerf and paring, sanding, etc., will cause a second mis-alignment. Your color stripes might line up, but your already-carved curvature WON'T line up after re-gluing the parts. The lower part will be much more narrow where it meets the upper part, thus requiring a whole new re-carving of the heel curves. This might be okay for you, but it'll be some work, for sure. I think Padma had the whole thing nailed down tight. You don't need to inlay his design (although it's a good design). You can inlay anything that will camouflage the original mistake. Think of it is a sure mark of hand craftsmanship. Anything that works for you and your client is a good design solution.

One proviso: Show everything--perhaps including this discussion thread--to your client, and show the person your proposed solutions. If the person doesn't like any of them, save this neck for your OWN future guitar, and make your client a new neck. My guess is that your client will love the various solution options, and will go with you on this.

A parlor? Cool! How about some pictures of that one?

So, from my opinion (for what its worth) I see each joint on the lamination as a weak point. What makes a laminated neck strong in the longitudinal strength created by the laminations which will stiffen the neck and help reduce twisting. However much of that longitudinal strength is lost on each one of those glue spots. Once the neck is thinned out there wont be much "meat" and a lot of stress will be on those laminations.

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Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

The heel looks plenty large enough to lose a small amount of wood. If one used a thin dovetail saw,and had skill,the glue line could be sawn out with a minimal wood loss in the vertical thickness of the heel. Bandsaw blades for the very small bandsaws are also quite thin. Though,I don't have knowledge of the OP's tools or machines.

Would having to plane a bit off of the tenon that goes into the guitar be a problem? Is the neck block already made/ Are the holes already drilled through the neckblock?

You know...this may be my favorite idea yet (and now that I think on it, it is kinda a no brainer)! It'll be the clients guitar, get them involved in the decision process for what to do with it. They should be pretty happy with your honesty and wanting to get their feedback too.


-Matthew

What's the big deal about making a new neck? This one didn't turn out right... so you make a new one. You will be glad you did!

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"No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man.” -Heraclitus of Ephesus

Cut off the heel and throw it away. -
This is the easy part.

Make a new one and glue it on. -
PITA to reproduce the laminated reinforcement, but there you are. Alternatively, replace it with a solid, non-laminated block, a look which I prefer. Make 'em a bit oversized. The gluing surfaces will have to mate perfectly. You can zero-in on a flat gluing surface on the neck with a safety planer; you may have to take the fretboard off for stability. Shim the neck so that the new glue line follows the top of the neck. In building up the replacement heel, I'd probably rout a mortise into it on a router table, make a separate tenon and glue it into the mortise. The existing tenon stub should help with aligning the new heel. If you go with the laminated center line, you'll have to pin the new and old, or the glue will slide all over the place (which, of course, you know.)

I'd sure try something like this before quitting and starting over. You've certainly got nothing to lose. And you will learn something about repair and woodworking, making you a better guitarmaker.

My suggestion may be the least welcome so far, but I believe will be the one that is most fair
to the customer involved.

Scrap that whole neck, get the proper size material and rebuild it using components that are
one full piece of the laminated neck without the need for a separate heel block or all of those
separate pieces in each laminate stripe.

It will result in a more dependable neck and the integrity will make for a happier customer.
I've never seen laminations done using short sections on the component layers and it just
strikes me as a shortcut that creates nothing but a bad situation.

Regards,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega Guitars