Official Luthiers Forum!

OK guys,i know this is a repair question rather than a build question but i need help with this and have already posted it on a couple or repair forums and gretsch sites but NO ONE has been able to give me a satifying answer.
Heres the deal...
As stated gotta 1958, 6190 cadillac green countryclub in for a setup.problem is the trussrod....whenever I tighten it,it actually increases the relief/bow in the neck.
When I loosen the rod the neck is almost straight with about .008"relief but this increases to about .014" whenever I tighten the rod.
The guitar sounds amazing and apart from the problem is in good condition .Never encountered this before....and the guitar looks like its never had any work done to it.
I'm no expert on gretsch's so hoping somebody here can help me out.
Anybody got any ideas bout whats going on.

.....can anybody tell me how easy it would be to remove the trussrod from this guitar?Could it be done without having to remove fingerboard......through a fret?If so ,which fret???
Cheers.

Soooo...why do you want to remove the truss rod again? Maybe I'm missing something.....

_________________
Wes McMillian
Santo, TX
http://www.wesmcmillian.com

Hi Wes and thanks for your reply.... maybe you are missing something....read the post again....this rod isn't working as should...its doing the reverse of what it should be...
Now,its not that I want to remove the trussrod,hell no if I can avoid it,but IF I have to,to get the rod working as it should is it an easy affair???
Thanks again.

Hi Wes and thanks for your reply.... maybe you are missing something....read the post again....this rod isn't working as should...its doing the reverse of what it should be...
Now,its not that I want to remove the trussrod,hell no if I can avoid it,but IF I have to,to get the rod working as it should is it an easy affair???
Thanks again.

Is there any chance this has some early version of a double acting truss rod? If not, why not consider the virtues of a compression refret? You can back bow the neck a bit with the compression and then push your relief with the truss rod.

Gretsch guitars have always been wildly inconsistent, just about the coolest things ever but they let some pretty gnarly things through. It is hard to advise without seeing the guitar, so my only advice is don't start pulling frets or trying to get the rod out without getting the in person opinion of a trusted repair person first. If you can get the thing to play well with its current truss rod, i would just call it good and chalk it up to funky gretsch charm.

_________________
Jordan Aceto
Ithaca, NY

Why would you want to remove the rod, it seems to be functioning though backwards. That is a cool old guitar why mess with it.

Fred

_________________
Fred Tellier
http://www.fetellierguitars.com
Facebook page http://www.facebook.com/pages/FE-Tellier-Guitars/163451547003866

the rod is working.albeit backwards.....but remeber those measurements for relief at the seventh fret are with strings removed....strings on and its a different story,
with strings on the relief is between .020"-.025" and thats with the rod not engaged.
I'm tempted to leave as is as it is a weird one and the guitar is of a vintage.....God i hate it when i'm beat.

Is there a reason you don't want to consider a compression refret? It's a common repair technique and may be well suited to your predicament.

No reason....other than I'm still unsure of why the rod is behaving as such and would like to know ......I find compression fretting quite a difficult procedure to do correctly.......as the rod isn't behaving as it should as it is I'd be worried that it would behave differently again after a compression refret.....
My first thought was a factory mistake.....rod in upside down....but surely these rods are single action rods buried deep so this couldn't be the case???

Is this a double rod upside down or a single rod with the curve in the wrong direction...?

_________________
A person who has never made a mistake has never made anything!!!

Know of anyone who can get you and x-ray of it? Any chance you live near an airport? Things are slow at night, maybe you can talk them into scanning it for you.

_________________
Aoibeann

These truss rods on the older ones were installed with the hump closer to the fingerboard and the ends further. The opposite to the way a fender strat was done. They were installed thru the back of the neck like old fender skunk stripe neck. Being so it will work in the opposite direction of a modern truss.

BINGO.....!!!

_________________
A person who has never made a mistake has never made anything!!!

Man!!!this sounds too good.......not to sound like a doubting thomas but can anybody else back up this information?????
Hers some pics for you.

FWIW, about 10 years ago I restrung a 50's Gretsch archtop at the shop I was working at, at the time. And the rod worked backwards as well. It was a surprise to me. so I just adjusted it backwards, and informed the owner when he picked it up. the owner knew squat about rods, but appreciated the info.

_________________
"...you have to get over your strict adherence to your largely imagined notion of absolute perfection..."

I have handled hundres of Gretsch guitars. All from 58 have the normal truss rod with normal relief location. But earlier (55 and earlier) thier truss rods worked backwards of todays designs. The earliest ones actually had a drum lug welded to the truss rod instead of a hex nut. So you used something that looked like a small wrench to turn it (It was square not hexed). A drum key works great too. You would turn the entire rod and not a nut. The nut was at the other end of the fretboard inside. That is not what this one is though..

Also, that aint' no 58 either. That is probably 56 or early 57 in which case, the truss rod is probably acting correctly. Hump block markers and dyna sonic pups places that (at the latest) mid 57. Give me the serial number and I can tell you exactly what time of the year it was made. For this one, its earlier enough that its probably acting correct due to the location of the hump (shape of the truss rod route). The truss rod (as far as I know) was always installed from the front (before the fret board was installed). I don't know if I have pics of the fret board off, but I can look. I would not touch the removal of this trussrod/fingerboard. It is what it is.

JD

_________________
Joe