Official Luthiers Forum!

Howdy folks!

I'm not a builder or even a repairer of guitars, just an "end user" as the computer geeks say. But Lance said it was OK to pose this question here and get feedback from anyone who cares to share their own preferences and practices.

Do you have a "standard" string height above the soundboard, measured at the bridge, that you generally shoot for in your guitars? If so, what is that height?

I guess that's pretty much equal to the height of the bridge plus the amount of saddle showing atop the bridge but I assume the string height is the driving parameter (so to speak) and you choose bridge and saddle heights to produce the desired string height. If that's not so, please enlighten me as to which of these are chosen first.

My favorite guitars, both steel-string and classical, seem to end up having the strings higher above the soundboard than the guitar I don't like as well. My fingerstyle guitar has about the tallest bridge/saddle combination I've ever seen and I really like its sound and response. So I'm curious as to what the "norms" might be and how that parameter varies across builders, across models or according to what you're trying to accomplish.

Welcome to the forum Brent.
In general, a string hight above the soundboard of 1/2" seems to be a good place to be. Some actual luthiers will be along soon to explain why.

Steve

Welcome Brent!

.500" is a probably a good number as long as the action is where you want it. More important in my opinion is the height of the saddle above the bridge...too low and the guitar will need a neck reset sooner...too high and it can be unstable...just right and the proper string break angle is achieved and everything falls into place better. It's all determined by the approximately 1.5* angle of the neck joint in relation to the bridge height. My bridges are typically .350" and shooting a straight-edge over the bridge calls for a saddle height of around .150" above the bridge for low action without buzzing that most players prefer. After building more than a few, it all becomes somewhat formulaic and the dimensions and angles become consistent.

The geometry is really revealing if you draw it out on paper full scale.

I hope that helps.

_________________
JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

One more thing to answer your question specifically...

1) I set my bridge height first at .350"
2) Next I set the angle of the neck joint such that I can extend a straightedge to achieve a specific height at the saddle location.
3) Finally, after the guitar is being set up, I set the saddle height to achieve the desired action...and it usually ends up about .150" above the bridge.

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JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

JJs got the steel strings pretty well covered.

On classicals 10mm (3/8" ) is a good height .
torque can twist top so much the bridge wants to separate from the top .
Also the string pull *(torque) can distort the top and may cause the top to cave in -in front of the bridge and raise the area behind the bridge .
I find 10mm works great for classicals and 8mm for Flamencos -this is because they need a lower string height to work with the bracing &
technique of the player.

BUT -I've seen strings as high as 15mm off the top on steels and as low as 6mm on nylons.
If a guitar is designed for a certain load(and neck angle)
the height will have to be adjusted for that load.
Most makers find what works for them sound(tone)wise and playing action.
There really is NO set height-just what the guitarmaker wants to see & hear.


Mike

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Mike Collins

So it really does sound like quite a range. JJ, do I understand your meaning that you consider the neck angle (generally around 1.5 degrees) to be the thing that needs to be right and the details of saddle and string height follow from that angle? Or are you just saying that 1.5 is about what it works out to when you get the projected-height that you like?

By the way, the two guitars I mentioned have sting heights of 16mm for the steel-string and a bit under 14mm for the classical. So it sounds like my feeling was correct, those are really high. I must say the steel-string is the most sensitive and overtone-y guitar I've ever played and the geometry allows a wonderfully low action. But that tall bridge/saddle combo puts a dangerous load on the cedar top, it's definitely light-gauge strings only.

Brent...the angle is not always 1.5*...but close. Mine can vary by +/- 0.5*. Whatever it is, I am able to rout the neck tenon cheeks to match the body angle using my handy Woolson neck tenon routing jig. Having used it for the past 8 guitars has made a remarkable difference in repeatability of action. As a result of keeping that angle consistent, I am able to have a fixed bridge height of .350" and the resulting .140" to .160" saddle height. It's amazing what starts to happen when you can control all of the angles and dimensions...consistency! And having that variable relatively under control allows us to concentrate tone control activities elsewhere.

And the "end user" only knows that it has low action without buzzing and nothing more...except for you, because you asked, and hopefully you now know the rest of the story!

_________________
JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com