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Why don't you do some glue test and tell us what you find out? I know PVA sure doesn't glue your fingers together like CA.

I like the sound of impossible to disassemble.

To be honest I think this is one of those overthinking moments for me. I'm not even sure I can pinpoint what stresses the bindings are under on a finished instrument and I am worrying about the possibility of a glue not being right? Too much thinking.

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Burton
http://www.legeytinstruments.com
Brookline, MA.

I haven't had any problems with just using water thin CA. That's all I've used and I just got a bottle of med. for sizing fret slots and I use it when changing tuner buttons.

Todd,
I had that problem once where the water thin CA ran inside the body. Made a mess!
I have since changed the way I "wick" in the glue.
I always make sure the glue has to wick up hill or dead level, never "down" into the joint.
For instance, Ill tape the bindings on, then once everything it tight and perfectly fit I take the guitar and lay it on its side, not the back or top, but the side, then ill start to wick in the ca on the low side of the guitar.
As you know it practically sucks right in a dry joint. I go between all my taped areas. After an hour I come back and pull the tape right off and then wick in more ca where the tape was. This will avoid the problem of gluing your tape adhesive to your wood, which can be a pain! Also, if you use 3M masking tape, its less of a mess that the brown binding tape.
After 15+ guitars doing it this way, I have gotten pretty good at not adding to the mess with too much glue. I also have no problems going around soft cutaways.

I think maybe the best tip/trick is to use "enough" and not too much glue in order to do it clean.

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

I have been annoyed with those glue/tape residue boogers before, i started padding on a fairly thick layer of shellac before binding, the crusties just pop off of the shellac with a chisel, and dont take any wood with them. Using just enough glue to tack the bindings down first, and then removing the tape and wicking glue in is better, but it is nice to be able to clean it up easily when i make a mess with too much CA.

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Jordan Aceto
Ithaca, NY

Todd,
When you did your test did you seal the channel with shellac . That is the only thing that gives me pause. The joint is wood, shellac, ca, wood.
Link

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Cut to size.....Beat to fit.....Paint to match.

I can tell you that if you use 3M strapping tape that you will see thos dissapper for the most part. For some reason or another CA does not cause them, at least near as much of them with 3M strapping tape and you see with Steewmack binding tape or even other strapping tapes.

hmm seems im backward... i used CA to do half a guitar, didn't like it, and used titebond for the other half, with a (marginally) better result.

it seems this experience has given me a rational fear of CA - it always seems to just have a little drip on the edge of the bottle that makes the whole bottle get stuck to everything, be it guitar, concrete or person.... and the way it wicks into endgrain when you know the bottle over.....

i think the main problem with me though, was that this was my first guitar, so i had no idea how much pressure would be needed to get a tight fitting bond with the binding,
i didn't realise how thin the thin CA would be... etc

Lesson learned, I might to a 50/50 of lmi white and CA on number 2 lol (ive fallen out with titebond aswell, who thought making glue dry yellow would be a good idea?)

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"Anything that happens, happens. Anything that in happening causes something else to happen, causes something else to happen. Anything that in happening happens again, happens again. Though not necessarily in that order." Douglas Adams

I never use thin CA out of the bottle, but transfer it in micro-pipettes. I buy them in bulk from Euphonon and the "neck" can be pulled to be as thin as you want.
I do my rosettes and bindings with CA, works great and see no reason to change.
BTW CA release with heat and I've corrected a couple of binding/purfling gaps with a heat gun. Hold it with a wood block and wick some thin CA, and it's as nothing ever happened.

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Laurent Brondel
West Paris, Maine - USA
http://www.laurentbrondel.com/

I have used CA for years prior to building guitars, so I am very familiar with the stuff. I use the small tips, like pipettes, that can be inserted on the tip of a regular CA bottle. Makes controlling the thin CA much easier.

Glued the back bindings on the SJ last night and got the top ones on today. Seemed to go very well. I'll scrape them down over the next day, and the body will be done...Oh yeah!!

Ken

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http://www.casperguitar.com

Get capillary tips for your bottles. They are cheap like $.05 each in bulk. Don’t squeeze allow the CA to flow on it’s own through the capillary tip. Set you bottle upright between uses allow the CA to drain back into the bottle.

50/50 PVA and CA surly not!!! the will not mix at all the water in the pva will causse the CA to set instantly

Frank Ford will take the pipette and bite it at the tip and streach it to thin it as Laurent suggested. And from watching a Dan Erlewine DVD I noticed he cut the end of a pipette of and put it over the bottle tip. I have done both and it worked well. Lately I've just been buying the small tubes when on sale at HF and using them. I like the pipette over the bottle tip too. One thing NOT to use is a syringe. The plunger will stick and that can be trouble. I learned that early on many years ago. So anyone new to this be aware not to use a syringe. (I don't know about a glass syringe though) And ALWAYS have EYE PROTECTION and some acetone near by or a bottle of nail polish remover. The one good thing about growing older and having to get reading glass is you always have eye protection on when doing this stuff. And a respirator won't hurt either.

One thing I haven't heard mention of is how well CA sticks to the oily woods compared to titebond. I assembled some small pieces of cocobolo on a furniture piece a few years ago and they came apart, one by one after a time. Admitedly, I didn't wipe with naptha or any other solvent first. Has there been any problems with CA sticking well enough on bindings or do most of you use solvents first? Does the shellac just take care of this?

Pipettes are a type of capillary tube wit built in reservoir. It does not mater if you use the tip adapter for your bottle or pipettes you need a capillary to be able to control the flow. But tapered bottle caps just allow too much flow to control.

What I don’t like about pipettes is that thy lay on there side or you have to make a cup like stand for them. I have also had some pipettes that the molded seam at the bulb end split open on me. Now that is nice mess but I have to admit that is maybe one in a hundred happening. I have a bottle with acetone that I place my used capillary tips on after use and back wash the capillary out. It is hard to do that with pipettes. But none the less pipettes work as well as capillary tips so no argument from me on their use.

That's why I like the little tubes. They are cheap when on sale, use it up and throw it away and grab another one. They fit into the hand well and give you good control over them. I think I use 3 of the 3g. tubes to bind a guitar and I use quite a bit CA which I could probably cut back on some. But you can see that in my tutorial. If you all haven't tried the little tubes you might want to give it a go and see how you like them. I didn't use to use them until it was suggested by someone and I gave it a try and I like it. The other thing is they are readly available and no need to wait for them arriving in the mail or a drive to get them. I hate to order a bottle and have to pay top dollar for it and then have a $10 shipping and handling fee on top of that. But if you use alot of CA I can see where it might be better for the large bottles and pipette. But if you haven't tried them, you all just might want to give it try and see if it works for you. It's just a suggestion and might be to your liking. Who Knows?

That is the capillary tube I spoke of. You can get it a straight length of tube or with an pre-molded adapter to fit on the spout of a standard CA bottle

Do you have a link for those?

http://www3.towerhobbies.com Search capillary and or CA tips

Thanks Michael, That must be what Dan had on his glue and I thought it was the end of a pipette. Although I cut the tip off a pipette and it worked. There is one at the link that comes with an extra length of tubing that I can see coming in handy for some repair work possibly.

slip of the tounge there! lol

you get what i mean though? pva on top ca on back or something similar....

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"Anything that happens, happens. Anything that in happening causes something else to happen, causes something else to happen. Anything that in happening happens again, happens again. Though not necessarily in that order." Douglas Adams

I just used CA on an OM w/cutaway, first time not using white PVA. I liked being able to stick the purflings
before I did the binding, especially in the tight cutaway bends. I also liked the ability to adhere short
sections of the binding at a time- especially in the cutaway, where I had problems getting the highly
figured flame maple to bend without kinks. I don't think I got quite as tight a fit as I'm used to getting
with the PVA wrapped with 20 yds of elastic binding tape, but that may be technique that I'll pick up
as I go. I also had cut the binding ledges slightly oversize to account for glue line, which I see isn't
wanted with CA. Oh well, I'll just sand a little more on the sides, won't be a problem for the small amount
I added. Overall, I'm pretty satisfied, I'll use CA on the next couple of builds...

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Gene

Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason- Mark Twain

Michael, I get mine from Tower as well. Love the things. Cheap and very controllable. Tower is also a good source for epoxy, self stick sand paper to stick on your sanding bars, and CA.

Ken

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http://www.casperguitar.com

YEP. I have been an avid RC aircraft moderler since about 1978 I guess Tower has probably over $4K or 5k of my hard eared money of the years I was really into large scale 1/4 scale to 1/3 scale for many years but I don't have the time any more to fly my biggies much. I resently have built about 10 electric park flyers 35"-45" wingspaners that I can take to my local city park and fly at the drop of a hat.

I actuall don't buy my capillary tubes through Tower. I get mine through my local RC club. Our club buys in bluck and sells to the members at cost+5%

Michael,

Yeah, Tower has a bunch of my mula as well. I've been pretty active in R/C for years. I have a few 1/5 scale aircraft, but never got into 1/3 scale. Had desires to but not the time. Like you, most of my flying now seems to be small electrics on LIPOs. I live on a lake and fly most of the time off water (or snow depending on season). It is just so convenient and no mess to clean up. I have some gorgeous nitro powered a/c that just sit around now--at least they are not getting rekitted!

Ken

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http://www.casperguitar.com

Hello All,

Interesting topic! Kind of ironic too, cause I just routed out the channels for purfling and binding,
on a OM cutaway, and was hoping I would find some new info. on installing them here at the OLF!

I understand most of what has been discussed, but, I’m having trouble with a couple of steps. If
anyone would care to elaborate a little further, I sure would appreciate it.

Here’s my take on it so far. First you seal the top and back, then rout out the channels, then seal
the channels, then pre-bend your purflings and bindings to fit, then tape them in place with all
your joints fitting tight including the miter cuts, then “Wick” in the CA. Then remove the tape,
and wick in more CA where you missed under the tape.

OK! I don’t quite get the term “Wick”, and I’m trying to understand how the CA makes it’s way
down between the binding and the wall of the channel if the binding is taped to the channel so
tightly?

Also, in my case, I have an additional problem to deal with. On this guitar I used for the first time
a dremel attachment I got from StewMac. It appears I will need much practice to master this tool.
I over cut the channel for the purfling as much as .040" to deep in a few areas on the top and back.
I read where Burton “sands the binding tops and pushes the dust over the purfs” “Then goes
around again with a very light squirt of CA” Not sure if this would work in my case. So, any
advise on this issue would also be appreciated.

Thanks, Robert

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