Official Luthiers Forum!

So, I'm in the talks with a few people about making an app for data recording for voicing the top.
like how thick the top is and what diflection. what angle you have the X brace at and all of the braces off of the X.
I'm looking to be able to record ever bit of thing you can with how you brace the top and may even try and see if we can record the sound of the top.
I was just wondering if this is something people would want to use and what other things you think I should have in the app for data recording.

Something like Luthier's Workbench that would work on IOS devices would be clutch

Snap thats rather in depth. I was thinking more for just for building the sounds box or for the whole guitar. not sure if I would use it for repairs. But doesn't mean I can't see if we can do it. I definitly would want to be able to take photo's and link it to each guitar.
I want to do a lot of what that program can do.

I like to have data like that at my fingertips. In your vision, is it just a way for the user to record their own data, or could it be a data-sharing program as well? If just for my own data, I'd be less likely to use it, as I already write those things in a notebook and l like that approach somewhat better than typing numbers in. But if it included sharing of other's data, it would be worthwhile to me.

I would like to be able to have it so you could email the data. that way you could print out or store it on your computer.
I like the idea of punching it in over writing it down. I have a bad habit of loosing or spilling stuff on my note books.
my idea is, that if you make a great sounding guitar and someone says. hey, I want one made to sound just like that one. you have all of the information at your finger tips to help give you the best shot of doing it.
I'm hoping to make it that is a very detailed way of recording everything.
like how far is the X from the sound whole. how heavy are the bracewood, top, bridge plate, and the bridge.
how tall are the braces.

Interesting idea.....but I don't think I'd use it. I just hate to use my phone while working....saw dust, glue smudges, finish drops, etc. I keep my records on the laptop before or after my shop time.
I also don't think a phone can record or play back well enough to really get a good sound clip of the top tone.
Anyway

I would want to use this app more for tablets then phones. But I want it to work with both. And for recording I would recommend getting a good mic for recording and not use the one on the phone or tablet.

I'd be interested in one that had calculations from the Gore/Gilet books built in ...

I no nothing on that and wouldn't know how too. I don't think I'll be putting that in the app since I want to use it for data recording.

Micah, it's definitely something I'd be interested in looking at. Something that looks at component weight, has option for stiffness, possibly records the final pitch of the top, etc, would be pretty cool.

Yeah, I want it to do all of that. It's hard to explain what all I want it to do over the forum. I'm a better phone talked haha.
I'm about to do a bunch of R&D and it got me thinking of doing this. I would rather have something to bunch it into then write it down.

Yeah, I agree. I created a Google Doc that I can access with my phone (of an iPad . . . I fantasize but can't justify an iPad Mini), but an app would just more user friendly. I certainly support your effort here.

FWIW, here's a copy I just made of my Google Doc. I made it viewable by anyone with a link, and anyone can comment. I would've made it editable, but that could go awry quickly.

Data Sheet

No promises, but we have an app in the late stages of development. Watch this space....

_________________
Trevor Gore, Luthier. Australian hand made acoustic guitars, classical guitars; custom guitar design and build; guitar design instruction.

http://www.goreguitars.com.au

James I really like your google doc. That has a lot of stuff I plan on using.
Trevor, what all is your app going to do? Is it mainly for the formulas for your book?

Ooh, wouldn't that be a splendiferous thing.

I dunno. . . .do you want to play with your phone or make guitars? I don't see the value in all those numbers. Are they just for geeky wannabes or am I just an old dinosaur? (Either way is cool.) Ever read "Zen and the Art of Archery"? Do something long enough and it will just come to you. Try to mess with the universe and the master will throw you out on your butt, even if you've found some tricks to help you to hit the target. After awhile it will occur to you that guitar making just isn't that hard. Follow the steps and you will get fine tone. Its the craft part you have to work at, the getting clean results. The best short cut is a good teacher. After that you just have to put in the time.

Ballyhoo.

Nothing wrong with starting with good quantifiable foundations that can be measured and repeated. And then you spend the rest of your life trying to surpass yourself. Craftsmanship will take time for sure, but why not give yourself a leg up instead of simply 'doing it long enough'?

I'll leave the zen for the archery range, the only thing I do that I could call a hobby....

Hahaaa! Took me 3 days to decipher your cryptic (to me) formulas and get it to work in Excel....

The data recording idea came from reading somogyis book. It's for if sometime down the road you were like man I really liked how number 14 came out and you were trying to remember how you did it. You can go back and see what you did with every little thing and have a good chance of doing it again.

That sounds VERY interesting!

Getting the craft part right is the easy bit.

Last time I was at Healdsburg, just about all the guitars there were finely crafted; tight joints, neat binding, well set up, VERY shiny, heaps of bling, etc, etc. Most of them sounded little better than what you can buy in the main street of Anytown.

There's a reason for that. Very few people can explain how to make a guitar sound right, and have any sort of logic or science behind the explanation, whilst endless numbers of people can explain how to make one look right and show people how to do it.

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Trevor Gore, Luthier. Australian hand made acoustic guitars, classical guitars; custom guitar design and build; guitar design instruction.

http://www.goreguitars.com.au

Right now, it's just doing plate formulae (elastic constants) and target thickness, but has no database function. Something like James' idea is fine for say X-braced guitars, but not for lattice/fans/falcate etc. But those sorts of logging functions are easy enough to set up in Excel or Word on an individual basis. If in Excel, you can plot variables, draw charts etc. if you want. Trying to do that in an app would mean presupposing that everyone wants to do the same sort of thing, which they won't, so the app will stick to the basics.

Question: What do you guys want to see it do?

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Trevor Gore, Luthier. Australian hand made acoustic guitars, classical guitars; custom guitar design and build; guitar design instruction.

http://www.goreguitars.com.au

I want to see it make me rich, beautiful, handsome and desirable beyond my wildest imaginings.

Failing that, I will be pleased if it brings me to a level of mere comepetence. Also, if it can do a plug and play function that will do the equations that I understand conceptually but cannot actually compute, that would not be a bad thing....

Just like me, you mean?

Sorry, but I haven't been able to explain that...



The current version has a step-through GUI which is pretty simple to use. Can't guarantee it's totally idiot proof, mind. I'll have to look up some of our local "idiots" and see what they can do to it!

_________________
Trevor Gore, Luthier. Australian hand made acoustic guitars, classical guitars; custom guitar design and build; guitar design instruction.

http://www.goreguitars.com.au

I'm hoping with this app to be able to have the option to custom lay out your braces. and maybe be able to pick threw a couple different bracing ideas. like X, lattis and fan.
There is a lot I want it to be able to do. the more I think about it, this able is going to be more tablet friendly then phone.
I met with one friend of mine but it and he thinks its do able. I just need to meet with another guy and see what he thinks.