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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:48 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 6:08 pm
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First name: ernest
Last Name: kleinman
City: lee's summit
State: mo
Zip/Postal Code: 64081
Country: usa
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Status: Professional
Have been using an 8 k japan woodworker stone for 23 yrs and also have a 10 -12 k chinese natural stone from woodcraft. I looked at the reviews on amazon mostly from st razor users . Can anyone out there give me some feedback on using this stone without the hype ,they are $150 currently at woodcraft . Thank you . I appreciate your input . I have a lot of hand tools .bliss


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 9:31 am 
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Cocobolo
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First name: john
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City: Alsea
State: Oregon
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ernie wrote:
Have been using an 8 k japan woodworker stone for 23 yrs and also have a 10 -12 k chinese natural stone from woodcraft. I looked at the reviews on amazon mostly from st razor users . Can anyone out there give me some feedback on using this stone without the hype ,they are $150 currently at woodcraft . Thank you . I appreciate your input . I have a lot of hand tools .bliss

I bought an 8000 grit ceramic stone a few years ago thinking I would like it. It is obviously not 8000 grit judging by the sharpened surface (not polished). I found it worked well for leveling my water stone (6000 grit) but don't use it for anything else. It is not a Shapton which I suspect is a much better quality product. I'll stick with natural water stones followed by stropping to put a real edge on knives and chisels and diamond stones for quick touch ups on pocket knives, router bits, etc.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:22 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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First name: ernest
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City: lee's summit
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Country: usa
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Could i ask you which 8k stone you bought ??Also found a sigma 13k stone also gets good reviews and is 113 $ us from L/V. Thanks john .


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:36 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:44 am
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First name: colin
Last Name: north
Country: Scotland.
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I'll be watching input on this topic with interest.
I very nearly bought a Shapton 16K last week, but instead bought a Naniwa 10k which was 2/3 the price, to replace my slate stones which are OK, but very slow to cut.
The Naniwa seems excellent, and needs no soaking - splash and go, same as the Shapton.

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These users thanked the author Colin North for the post: ernie (Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:59 am)
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:50 am 
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First name: Mark
City: Concord
State: NC
Country: USA
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I can buy a lifetime supply of 1 micron diamond paste (Shapton 16K is ~.9 micron) for $150. I put a pea size drop of it on a sheet of phone book paper taped to a piece of glass and go with very light pressure. It will last me 5-6 honings on chisels and plane irons. https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-bottle-THK-1-0-micron-Diamond-polishing-lapping-paste-pastes-compound-20-Gram/121297310332?_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.DEFAULT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D41375%26meid%3Ddc8b9e6dabe848509310f705b7d27dc2%26pid%3D100752%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D131142494463&_trksid=p2047675.c100752.m1982



These users thanked the author Mark Fogleman for the post: ernie (Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:01 am)
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 11:05 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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First name: ernest
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Mark good pt .I have a granite flattening plate that I use when I/m too lazy. If I just had a few edge tools , definitely the way to go with a diamond paste .I/ve noticed that with japanese plane blades the sharp edges get rounded on the granite plate using sandpaper .I also have a machined alum plate (.001)with 180 paper for flattening backs that also works quite well


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 1:20 pm 
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Cocobolo
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First name: john
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City: Alsea
State: Oregon
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Country: usa
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ernie wrote:
Could i ask you which 8k stone you bought ??Also found a sigma 13k stone also gets good reviews and is 113 $ us from L/V. Thanks john .

Sorry Ernie, I can't remember the site name. It was a woodcarver's page. I think I paid about $80 for the stone and was very disappointed with it since it is most assuredly not 8000 grit. I wrote a note to the site owner complaining and received no reply so I haven't dealt with them since.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 1:47 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 6:08 pm
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First name: ernest
Last Name: kleinman
City: lee's summit
State: mo
Zip/Postal Code: 64081
Country: usa
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
No worries john, sorry about the bum stone you got , what a drag that it did not pan out. My 8k and 6k stone is wearing thin and needs vy frequent flattening with a 120 git atoma diamond stone.I/ve bought most of my stones from either japan woodworker or woodcraft. Now they are 1 and the same. Got most of mine in ca. I did buy the allegedly 10-12k chinese blue natural stone from our local woodcraft. Being the impatient sort I find it is way too slow , imho a long meditation. and at my age i/d rather polish and be done with it


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 6:33 pm 
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honestly, I don't see the point of going to such high grits. I have a sigma 13K and like it a lot but i also think it's only catering for my obsessive demeanour. It does have a very nice touch and leaves a beautiful mirror edge but I don't see any practical difference if I stay at 8K. The Sharron pro 1K (the only shaptonni have) is a very nice stone.

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These users thanked the author mqbernardo for the post: Colin North (Sat Oct 28, 2017 5:38 am)
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 5:59 am 
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mqbernardo wrote:
honestly, I don't see the point of going to such high grits. I have a sigma 13K and like it a lot but i also think it's only catering for my obsessive demeanour. It does have a very nice touch and leaves a beautiful mirror edge but I don't see any practical difference if I stay at 8K. The Sharron pro 1K (the only shaptonni have) is a very nice stone.

Basically I agree.
Having used a DMT extra extra fine (supposed to be 8000, but closer to 3000 with scratches) for a time as my highest grit, I obtained a welsh slate about 8/10k and it's quite good, but cuts very slowly.
But did notice a fair difference in the surfaces I planed and the ease of chisel use.
Biggest differences I've noticed with the Naniwa 10K is the speed and feel of sharpening, the ease and smoothness of planing hardwoods at high angles (60 degrees) and the surface finish. Not used it for chisels yet.
I understand the Shapton 16K is actually mixed grits, not uniform, finest being 0.9 micron, and the others break down with use.
Perhaps this is why the surface it cuts is apparently not such a mirror finish as other 10K+ stones, not that I'm knocking it in any way.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 28, 2017 8:33 am 
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Koa
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Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:33 am
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First name: Willard
Last Name: Guthrie
City: Cumberland
State: Maryland 21502
Zip/Postal Code: 21502
Country: United State
Focus: Repair
Status: Semi-pro
As with others, we don't go beyond 8000 grit Norton or Shapton Pro waterstones for normal honing due to the lack of noticable increase in edge durability/usable sharpness. On the rare occasions we do go to 15000 grit (usually for initial honing of carving tools), we go to the 8000 grit stone first. Both the 8000 stones mentioned provide a nicely polished bevel and back, with both just spritzed to wet prior to use.

We generally use a two stone system for sharpening - a large 3" x 10" DMT DuoSharp C/XC combination mono-crystalline diamond stone and an 8000 grit waterstone (Norton or Shapton Pro) to finish. The DupSharp coarse side (325 grit) quickly strips the dead edge from the dull blade, and the 8000 grit waterstone refines the edge to a polished finish. The XC side of the diamond stone quickly flattens the waterstone, as well as provides the ability to regrind the ground bevel when away from the CBN radiused edge wheel-equipped low speed grinder in the shop. We do not strop chisels or plane blades, but instead work to remove the burr versus risking changes to the edge geometry we create with a fresh honed bevel.

A note here: we use the term 'ground bevel' and 'honed bevel' in the shop and manual versus primary and secondary bevel to avoid confusion with the practice of creating multiple, honed bevels.

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These users thanked the author Woodie G for the post: ernie (Sat Oct 28, 2017 10:51 am)
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