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Would someone please elaborate on this concept please.

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I'm no expert, but the idea is to scoop out the fingerboard wood in between all adjacent frets so that, when you press down the string, your fingers don't bottom out on the wood. You can press harder than needed to simply fret the note in question, which allows some expressive freedom; vibrato can be much more pronounced, you can "bend" by just pushing harder, etc.

Personally, I like simply using very tall frets.

John Mclaughlin used a guitar with a scalloped fret board, and a set of lute strings (?) diagonally across the sound hole, when he played with Shakti.
He had a great sound with it, but he could pink Daisy sound good!

Alex

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"Indecision is the key to flexibility" .... Bumper sticker

Yngwe Malmsteen...

It is interesting, but a novelty, IMO...do it to your backup guitar, not your main...

I scalloped my first acoustic`s and 3 of my electric`s fingerboards. I am a big fan of scalloped fingerboards. I do believe that they help with my speed as well as my ability to bend. The scallop allows you to push the string with more meat of your finger, which makes bends easier. I have a problem of the strings popping out from underneath my fingers during bends. The floating feeling constantly reminds you to not press so hard or you will go sharp. The scallop also allows you to do pressure bends and vibratos. On my acoustic that is scalloped I can do SRV bends all day with it. Aesthetically, I think scalloped boards look silly.

Did a bunch of them back in the 80's when it was really popular.
It's a pain in the butt, whether you use power tools or hand tools - so I charged accordingly.
And having played scalloped fretboards, as well as jumbo frets - I can see no difference.
If you really think it's a matter of fingertip friction - you are kidding yourself.
But I'll still take your money.

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"Act your age, not your shoe size" - Prince

A completely different approach to scalloped boards was taken by Hobart Middlebrooke, and later Fred Van Eps--both banjo makers. Middlebrooke patented his board in the 1890s, and Van Eps applied for a patent, but it was apparently not granted (probably due to Middlebrooke's existing one). At any rate, these fingerboards have flush metal frets and are scalloped between these flush frets. They were both intended for gut string use. These instruments play as if they were fretless, except they're always in tune. Super super smooth going up and down the fingerboard.

I had an L00 Gibson that Fred Van Eps had modified with one of his flush fret scalloped boards, and it was the best playing guitar I ever played. It was set up with light gauge steel strings and was an absolute delight. My wife's cousin is a much better player than I am, so I let him have the thing.

The difference in feel between one of these flush fret scalloped boards and a Malmsteen type fretted board is like night and day.

I don't know what Middlebrooke's process was, but Van Eps scalloped the boards before cutting fret slots. I have a bunch of stuff from Fred's estate, and a scalloped fingerboard, unslotted, is among that stuff.

Dave

Very interesting post, Dave.
Any chance you could look out that scalloped fingerboard and give us some idea of how deep the scallops are ..ie the depth in the middle, in between the fret locations, and if they are the same depth all the way up the board?

That type of scalloped fretboard (with flush frets) goes way back, to before the middle of the 19 th century. It's found on French Romantic Guitars, although fairly rare. Lacote did some as well, although his had raised frets as far as I'm aware. But certainly 50 or 60 years before that patent for sure. Who knows whether Middlebrook was aware of the much earlier fretboard but he must have been aware of the other, more familiar type of scalloped fretboard. It was well known of in the mid 19 th century.

Jeez. I just wrote a long post on this and it did not register. Short story is, higher frets have a similar effect.

I am trying to imagine this... so pretty much like metal bar stock inlayed into the board? I'd love to see a picture if you have one handy...

That's pretty much it. I don't have any pictures handy right now, but here's a link to a site where a fellow is building new versions of the Van Eps banjo. The pictures show how the scalloping and the flush frets work pretty clearly.

http://classic-banjo.ning.com/forum/topics/more-photos-of-eric-stefanelli-s-ultimate-classic-banjo

I found this.

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I'm not a luthier.
I'm just a guy who builds guitars in his basement.
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And here's a link to the Google Patents page showing Middlebrooke's patent:

https://www.google.com/patents/US463954?dq=middlebrooke+banjo&hl=en&sa=X&ei=WqkoVIvxPLCj8gG97YG4CA&ved=0CEIQ6AEwBQ

The Middlebrooke fingerboards are unique in that the scallops are asymmetrical. There is a sudden drop off of the flush fret with a ramp up to the next flush fret. I own several Middlebrookes, and they are very comfortable to slide up the fingerboard, not so much sliding back down. Kind of like saw teeth, although not that abrupt....


<edit> Whoops, a bit late with that one!
Dave

They are indeed the same depth all the way up the board, and about 1/16" deep or a little less on both the Van Eps and the Middlebrooke. The radius is obviously tighter the higher up the fingerboard you go--it looks to me like Van Eps used either a ball end mill or maybe even a sanding drum. The lower frets aren't as perfect semi-circles in cross section as the higher frets are, so I think that he used a single radius cutter of whatever type and then created a flatter bottom of the scallop.

The Middlebrooke patent makes it look like a very abrupt transition, but the scallops are very subtle on the actual instruments--probably more subtle than the Van Eps, just due to the difference in shape of the scallops.

Dave

This has been some interesting reading, thank you . Glad I asked . I had not seen them before this weekend, it never ceases to amaze me how much there was accomplished in past centuries in design technology

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Alex

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"Indecision is the key to flexibility" .... Bumper sticker

Thanks Dave ...just one more question if you don't mind ... is your Van Eps fretboard flat across the width, like a classical guitar, or is it radiused across the width as a normal steel strung guitar would be ?

I beg to differ....or at least postulate a difference.

From a playing standpoint...yes...high frets might feel the same...but...

As a note is played the wave will bounce off the fretboard and return to affect the string....to some degree. Not much energy is there but having a flat fret board will return whatever energy back to the string in a parallel manner. Scallops will break that wave into focused sections and that energy will come back off the fretboard in broken pieces.

I'm not adamant about this, nor can I explain with any precision what to expect...but there WILL be some difference between a scalloped and flat fretboard in this regard.

The only reason I conjured this theory is because I scalloped a Stratocaster and perceived a tonal difference when I was done. It seemed to have more of that Strat "quack" which would be an increase in the amplitude of second and third harmonic.

Scalloping will force players to consider, and eventually alter, their playing style with the use of lighter strings. It forces a light touch due to string bending. This is good or bad depending on your playing style but it's a valid consideration before you start down that road. You may HATE it after it's done. Personally, I love it. I feel it helped me play more delicately by eliminating the tactile sensation of the fingerboard and forcing me to think only about my finger placement directly on the string. I played that Strat exclusively for about ten years. Today I can play normal guitars but I play with a very light touch and rarely touch the fretboard.

In a nutshell, taking away the fretboard surface took away a "crutch" that I used to wrangle a good note out of one that was playing imperfectly. Not that I'm some splendid example of a guitar player...it's just that I can see the mechanics of a scalloped neck that will force the development of a refined technique.

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Yngwie does it because he plays those vintage strats with tiny frets and so scalloping the fretboard let's him get under and still bend the notes, which is difficult to do with small frets as you are rubbing the fretboard so much and can't really push the strings across effectively. Also scallops eliminate the friction of the fingers encountering the fretboard completely so you can play faster and more efficiently VS using just high frets. I can still feel the fretboard with high frets.

That's my take on it.

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The Unfinished Van Eps fingerboard I have is for a banjo and is flat across the width. The Van Eps L-00 guitar was radiused across the width, as are all of the Middlebrookes.

Dave

If you are going to try to make one, keep this in mind. If you ever now have a tendency to pull the high e string off the fret board when you play, that trait will be amplified when your finger no longer touches the board causing some friction to resist the pull. This is compensated for by making the space between the string and the edge of the board a little wider. That can be accomplished on retrofitted classicals by moving the nut notches closer together and not symmetric, so that they are away from the treble side. I do not know if there is enough room on a steel string nut to do that. You might want to make the board a little wider from the beginning.

I'm not doubting that this is what you have read or heard; I'm instead puzzled by the quirky logic of the owner, if that is a main reason for scalloping. If low frets on a vintage instrument are holding you back, I think the smarter solution is to refret, not scoop wood out of the fingerboard. If refretting hurts the value of a vintage instrument, just think what scalloping does!

The Essig Collection of musical instruments at the University of Central Missouri includes a lute with a scalloped fingerboard. I don't know the instrument's age, but this concept has clearly been around a long while.

could it be true that scalloping reduces fret buzz from poor placement of fingers?

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