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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 6:35 pm 
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Cocobolo
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Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 1:13 pm
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Last Name: Ellis
City: Manteca
State: CA
Zip/Postal Code: 95337
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Is there really any difference?

I'd be interested to see if anyone knows the manufacture of LMII white.


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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 7:24 pm 
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Koa
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Location: Ellicott City, Md - USA
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read this thread - it is very clear - I also thought they are the same - but they are not -

http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=35915&hilit=gorilla+white


here is the short answer from Hugh Evans - who works or used to work at Franklin

Quote:
Based on what I've heard about the LMI product, I do not believe it is related to gorilla's PVA wood glue. It's a ANSI/HPVA type II water resistant product, and LMI is clearly a uncatalyzed PVA that will readily dissolve in water when dry. I ran some competitive tests for a project a little over a month ago to evaluate its performance.

Results from ASTM D-905 Shear Strength Competitive Testing (Reported as Avg. ± 90% Confidence Interval):
Test articles were assembled from hard Maple, Acer Saccharum, and tested in a MTS Universal Tester with a 100kN load cell.

Titebond II
Room Temperature: 3922 ± 160 PSI
150°F Overnight: 1718 ± 110 PSI

Titebond III
Room Temperature: 3467 ± 280 PSI
150°F Overnight: 1295 ± 464 PSI

Elmer's Max
Room Temperature: 2255 ± 259 PSI
150°F Overnight: 1158 ± 52 PSI

Elmer's Carpenter's
Room Temperature: 3655 ± 530 PSI
150°F Overnight: 981 ± 300 PSI

Gorilla Glue
Room Temperature: 1263 ± 269 PSI
150°F Overnight: 698 ± 169 PSI

Gorilla Wood Glue
Room Temperature: 3393 ± 203 PSI
150°F Overnight: 1727 ± 173 PSI

I have not tested Gorilla Wood Glue's water resistance claim, but it is a well performing product from a strength perspective. Keep in mind that strength at elevated temperature correlates directly to creep resistance. Most people are unfamiliar with confidence intervals. They are a statistical calculation similar to margin of error. All of the values reported above therefore describe that the true value, lies within ± CI of the calculated average with 90% certainty. Due to wood variation, good test results typically have confidence intervals of ~20% the average.

Let me know if there are any questions.

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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2012 9:53 pm 
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Koa
Koa

Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 11:42 pm
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Last Name: Rein
City: Saline
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They are about as different as day and night. Gorilla is very flexible and rubbery to make it suitable for outdoor use. LMI White is brittle and decidedly not exterior grade.

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