Official Luthiers Forum!

Steve Saville recently turned me on to this type of sander. I was wondering if any of you guys have used or built one for yourselves.

What I kind of like about it is, it's works more like jointer, and I see no reason why a fence couldn't be set up to do just that.

Seems, it would be great for getting stock flat but somewhat at the expense of an even thickness.

More info: http://lumberjocks.com/projects/20482






Here's a Youtube link to one being used


So what do you guys think?

_________________
Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)

First off, I would kind of like to see a longer platten at the front of the feed.(less at the back)

_________________
Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)

This is no replacement for a drum sander - especially when working with relatively thin, wide wood as in guitar building. I think you would be in for a lot of frustration trying to make it work.

Pat

_________________
There are three kinds of people:

Those that make things happen,
those that watch things happen,
and those that wondered what happened.

Billy,

Like the other Pat said, it's not a replacement for a drum sander. On wood as thin as a top or back, controlling how much is being taken off would be impossible to control properly. Also, its usefulness as a quasi-jointer would be limited by not having an adjustable outfeed table. Sorry.

Pat

_________________
formerly known around here as burbank
_________________

http://www.patfosterguitars.com

Pat - You might be right, I don't know.

For thin wide parts, you'd have to use some kind of backer to hold it. If so, it might work well. I don't know. Although Billy refernced me in the opening of this thread, I have no dog in this fight. He asked about alternatives to a drum sander and I told him about this. I do not own one and I have never used one, but from what I have seen on Youtube, it looks like it could be an inexpensive substitute for a standard drums sander. Sure, it is not the same thing, but I think it could work.

Are you offering your opinion based on your experience, opinion, another's experience?

_________________
"An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered." G. K. Chesterton.

AND, the darn thing is expensive for what you get (yes, I know there is a kit, and also the whole shebang). It's been a while for me, but when I compared prices to a good buy for a Jet 10-20, they were not far apart. And as others have said, this tool is no appropiate for thicknessing thin wood. BTW, one could build an adustable outfeed based on the kit and get a really nice sanding jointer! Now that idea appeals to me. (but Im not gonna do it, my wife thinks I have plenty of tools)

Mike

It's better as a finish sander for cabinet type parts and products, where precision thicknessing is not an issue. It is a good product, and works very well, but there are just too many variables to work as a fine thicknessing tool. I'm sure you could make it work, but the feed variables will always be a problem, with no auto-feed feature. The design only removes very small amounts of wood at one time. When set up properly, the grit, when the drum is at rest, is below the surface of the V. You could push wood across and it wouldn't scratch the surface. It's centrifugal force that puts the grit into cutting position, as it pulls against the hook and loop fastening system. That's why it does not burn wood. It does not create a dust cloud, and that's nice, so dust collection is simple. The demonstrations are very impressive, but, mostly, they use soft woods, that sand easily.

_________________
Waddy

Photobucket Build Album Library

Sound Clips of most of my guitars

In fairness I should have stated that my comments were not based on personal experience but on the experience of a friend that bought one. He bought one after seeing it demonstrated at a wood show. At home, he found it not so easy and pretty limited.

Pat

_________________
There are three kinds of people:

Those that make things happen,
those that watch things happen,
and those that wondered what happened.

I was interested in these after seeing them on the net. I watched a demo for a good 45 minutes, by Stockroom Supply, at a woodworking show 3 years ago.Very good for sanding cabinet doors smooth. Not good for thicknessing guitar sets. I bought a Delta 18/36 instead. I have a buddy in Kansas who built one to do sets, and was disappointed that it was not accurate for thicknesing.

Bob

I had a Sandflee:
http://www.rjrstudios.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=SF-1800&Category_Code=SF
Used it to strip paint off Kitchen cabinet doors. Finishes don't stick to the abrasive and it lasts a long time. Not what I would use to thickness/level unless you can find P30 hook and loop abrasive and have all day. Great for finsh sanding large, flat panels though.

I do have one. It does a lot of what they say. It doesn't burn. ALL dust is easily collected. It is great for flattening doors, but not like a jointer. The table is all in one plane. I haven't tried redoing the table with a jointer style offset table.

For luthiery stuff, it is not what you want. I've tried it for smooth sanding plates, but they cup one way or another and you end up with irregularly thicknessed plates. It's sort of usable, but not my first choice.

I don't have anything against mine, but I don't use it. I might see if I can repurpose it into a drill powered rolling pin sander...

Mike

_________________
Mike Lindstrom

I thought this was a drum sander? ( Sorry Pat, can't resist being a smart ass sometimes...er.. all the time)



That's right! Steve has a supergawdamit Performax right in the middle of his shop. Nice machine!



Yup! I never even considered buying the kit! It doesn't take a genius to figure how the thing works. It's a box with pillow blocks. Little too expensive for what it is. It's simplicity is what attracted me too it.



That's part of the problem as I see it too Waddy, I believe, it's really a finish sander as designed. If the roller is variable in diameter then it can't give a consistently flat surface let alone thickness.



Yes Chris! I believe that too as in this form.



Thanks Mike! That what I wanted to hear.

Doing a jointer type take up table was what I was looking at. Even though, with that, the stock would still not be flat.

I think most people confuse flat with thickness. A conventional thickness sander doesn't guarantee flatness either but will give consistent thickness. The only real way to test to flatness would be with a surface table or a good straight edge.

Flatness itself it not really a critical part of luthiery as most components are bent or curved anyway, Other than the neck! I was just kicking around bulding a jointer sander using this principle and wanted to hear input from others that have one or understand experiences other have.

What attracted me to this design is the simplicity, therefore ease of building, and the obvious ease in dust collecting.

I see no reason why a retaining roller couldn't be put directly over the sanding drum to insure consistent thickness, in reality having your cake and eating it too! A thickness sander/jointer.

Speaking of flatness, Steve also has, what I was considering getting too and that's a granite topped bench. Very handy! (hope Steve doesn't mind me giving away his luthier secrets)

Thanks Guys! You got anymore comments I'm more than willing to hear them.

_________________
Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)

A retaining roller over the sanding drum won't get you uniform thickness.
If you look at a commercial drum sander, the retaining rollers are actually pushing the item away from the roller onto the flat feed belt.
It is the flat feed belt platten set at a variable distance from the roller which gives you the uniform thickness.

I own one and have used it but without some type of control on the material as it goes over the drum, accuracy is not consistent. I have made a spring loaded roller system and mounted in vertical t-slots and attached to fences on each side. I am going to run some tests to see if accuracy can be improved. I will post more once I have some results.

If you aver want to come and use it let me know.
Just bring your own sand paper.
One thing about this machine is that you can spend a lot of money on paper. I

_________________
"An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered." G. K. Chesterton.

Thanks Steve! I might take you up on that.



That goes without saying! Wide belt paper adds up fast. Who do you use as a supplier?

_________________
Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)