Official Luthiers Forum!

Are there any suppliers of finished fret with semi hemispherical domes other than fine frets?
finefrets.ca
Mike Mcnerney

_________________
Mike McNerney

Mike I don't know anything about this outfit so this is not an endorsement - it is simply what I found searching with Google: http://www.finefrets.ca/

Yes this is the one I mentioned in my post. I saw them at the Montreal show & they are beautiful.
Mike

_________________
Mike McNerney

Yeah I should do a better job of reading.....

Interesting but the part I'm not understanding is don't you still have to level then re-crown and polish the frets after installation? And when you do that don't you have to touch up the fret ends again? Unless you feel that the above steps are unnecssary (and I won't comment on that) then I don't see the point.

Pat

_________________
There are three kinds of people:

Those that make things happen,
those that watch things happen,
and those that wondered what happened.

I do not know how realistic this is, but it is my understanding that if:

1) The fret board is prepared properly; and
2) The frets are seated properly,

then you do not need to level and recrown.

Not sure I'd want to bank on that.
I always thought it might be tough to install so the ends all lined up. Anyway, there's a long thread at MIMF re best way to round fret ends after installation.

_________________
Dave
Milton, ON

Why pay someone to do a job that's really easy to do for yourself? Harry Fleischman wrote a short article on this that was published in the GAL journal a few years back. I can dig out the exact reference later tonight if needed. Basically, you measure carefully, then remove a short section of the fret tang rail (for want of a better description) on each end of the fret (I use the fret tang filing jig from LMI for this - it makes life very easy and I end up with perfectly formed ends), then using a fine file to carefully semi-hemishpherically shape the fret ends, then rub them out with 600grit and 1500grit wet and dry, then polish with paste on a cork-lined scrap of wood, then polish off with a dry rag. Done!

I dome all my frets. It takes me about 4 hours to do a complete fretboard's worth, but it's time well spent IMO. Lining the domed ends up on the fretboard is a non-issue in my experience. As long as you've made them all the right length, and fitted them carefully, there is no problem with the ends lining up. There's a picture of my LMI jig in use, and some of my finished dome-ended frets in a showcase on my website at the bottom of this page.

I have yet to have to file down (flatten/recrown) any fret on any of my guitars. Inevitably, I know I will have to, and when that time comes, I will have to find a way to re-dress the domed fret end......and I'm sure that it's not going to be easy!

Cheers,
Dave F.

_________________
Cambrian Guitars

"There goes Mister Tic-Tac out the back with some bric-brac from the knick-knack rack"

If you do some searching you will find this discussion in the past in which David Collins would not bank on not having to level and recrown either.

I know that Mario has perfected his process where he can install frets with a methodology that provides him with nearly flawless fret jobs. IIRC he once said that he rarely has to touch any frets after installing him.

Short of knowing and using his method exactly as he does or coming up with one of our own that works I seriously doubt that any of us is capable of installing a product with pre-made fret ends and then not having to touch the frets. It also depends on your own definition of what level is....

For me level means sub .001 measurements no thicker than the ink of a marking pen on the fret tops.... I am sure that I am not consistent enough with a hammer or press to install frets that do not need leveling afterwords again without some method that is proven to work and perhaps the tooling that goes with it. Starting off with a perfectly level fret board is standard fare for any fret job and not something that is specific to one method or another.

I also agree that shaping fret ends to any possible shape that your heart desires is not at all difficult. We often get no practice as we do the things that we must to build a guitar. Make a sacrifice fret board and spend an evening practicing installing and shaping your fret (ends). You will find that in no time at all you understand how to work the materials and make them work for you. This goes for nearly everything that we do - test it out and find out for yourself what works for you - you will be very glad that you did.

I'll borrow from my friend The Padma - Just Do It!!!

Mr. Fifield,
When you shape your dome do you just use a flat mill file or could a concave fret crowning file be of good use here? Thanks for the polishing schedule.
Mike McNerney

_________________
Mike McNerney

Hi Mike,

I use a fine flat file. I guess you could use a concave fret crowning file though. You'd have to ensure you kept it exactly in line with the fret throughout the filing operation though - one slip from dead-straight and you'll end up with gouges in the sides of the fret, right?

To form the domed ends, I start with the fret held solidly in a vice (using a piece of hardwood with a thin slit cut part through it to hold the fret tang), with one end sticking out. I start with the flat file vertical (perpendicular to the fret) and, using only about 8 to 10 fairly soft strokes moving around the end of the fret, form a rounded end. Then I angle the file and round off the two top corners that are left by the first filing operation, forming the dome end. I learned quickly with the first few I did that it's easy to over-file the end. Just a few strokes of the file is all that's needed. The 600grit wet/dry paper really cleans the dome up.

What I particularly like about doming the ends prior to fitting the frets is that I don't have to dress the ends again. With the traditional fretting method using a big file (set into a block of wood, whatever) after putting the frets in, it's easy to damage the fretboard/binding edges with just one small slip.

With regard to fret flatness, I'm following in Mario's footsteps - he is the master, and it is he that inspired me to attain fret flatness from the get-go! I check the flatness with a variety of straight edges as I put them in. I use a 24" Pinnacle straight edge over all the frets, as well as one of those little "fret rockers" from Stewmac to ensure each fret is dead level with the one before and after it as I go. I haven't measured the coplainarity of my frets, but I'd say it must be in the 1 to 3 mil range given my straight edge is only guaranteed to be less than 1 mil out per foot. Certainly, I get no buzzes or other issues, and several players have complimented my fret work.

Cheers,
Dave F.

_________________
Cambrian Guitars

"There goes Mister Tic-Tac out the back with some bric-brac from the knick-knack rack"