Official Luthiers Forum!

Owned and operated by Lance Kragenbrink
It is currently Tue Jul 22, 2025 5:25 pm


All times are UTC - 5 hours


Forum rules


Be nice, no cussin and enjoy!




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Question on 'stickering'
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:06 am 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 10:54 am
Posts: 378
Location: Between Bordeaux and the Atlantic. S.W.France
Is it normal practice to sticker in between each piece of a bookmatched front or back or sides, or do you put the 'good' surfaces together and sticker between sets?

The reason I ask is because I pulled out the mahogany back set I'm using and it had very noticeable 1/2"-wide pale stripes where the stickers had been. This might not have been a problem if the set were the same thickness as the other fronts and backs I have, which are all between 3/16" and 1/4" (I have very little). This one came at 0.120". When I asked if this was normal I was told that if I wanted it thicker, I should have said so. I'm using it to make an ABG and the back thickness should have been 1/8". Obviously it's going to be less now.

If I hadn't put stickers between the 2 halves the pale stripes would only have been on the inside of the instrument but might this have had a detrimental effect when I seperated the 2 pieces? Cupping, etc?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:21 am 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo

Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2006 8:03 am
Posts: 456
Location: Toronto, Canada
Dave, if the wood is dry and being stored in a controlled environment you don't need to sticker at all, I just stack flat with weight on top. If the wood is not dried it each piece should be stickered individually

_________________
David White, Toronto

"All my favourite singers can't sing."


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:37 am 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13631
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Dave my friend what David said.

I sticker each set, with the two halves together and no stickers between them. You only really need to keep things that you are unsure of stickered for about a year which is ample. The guidance that I have received here is sticker one inch for a year. After that as David says the sets can be just stacked flat on top of each other.

Stickers should be something that will not stain.

It sounds like one half of this set that you have was too thin to begin with. For an acoustic I like to join plates at about .140 and then final thickness based on deflection testing. Since typically I will be removing perhaps .020 or more this helps to hide the glue joint. With a .120 set there is absolutely no room for anything less than a perfect joint which is not something that I would anticipate that I could do every time if at all.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:28 am 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 10:54 am
Posts: 378
Location: Between Bordeaux and the Atlantic. S.W.France
Thanks David and Hesh. I think I'll pull some of those stickers out.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:38 am 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian
Old Growth Brazilian

Joined: Tue Dec 28, 2004 1:56 am
Posts: 10707
Location: United States
What you mentioned does not sound like a stain but rather the air exposed portion of the wood may have oxidized. This is not at all unusual for mahogany and should even out in the time needed to work the wood.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 11:47 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 7:50 am
Posts: 3152
Location: Canada
David,
Michael nailed it! Your set have just oxidized and where the stickers are they did not go darker (as Honduras will). You should just ignore those marks and glue your set up. Using a cleat on each side of the glue joint you should be able to get the seam very flat while glueing. Once it is glued then pick your weapon, a cabinet scraper or ROS, either will "freshen up" the wood so it looks homogenous again and you will still be in .110 are when you are finished. If you are really stuck I have some Honduras large enough for an ABG but I think you can make your set work with care....

Shane

_________________
Canada


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 5:39 pm 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 10:54 am
Posts: 378
Location: Between Bordeaux and the Atlantic. S.W.France
Thank you Michael and Shane. I did, in fact, realise that the stickers had prevented the wood changing colour where they were in contact with it. I'm not sure whether it's oxydation or photo-summat-or-other. I think it's exposure to UV that does it. Anyway, I joined the back as carefully as I could and then took a cabinet scraper to it and the stripes have almost gone now. I'm not sure how thick it is but I think it will be OK.

I just had a thought. I wonder if anyone has tried 'ageing' a very white spruce top on a finished instrument by giving it a UV bronzing session.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Hemessy, JimKlingshirn and 29 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
phpBB customization services by 2by2host.com