Official Luthiers Forum!

Yo, Flippo...

Me big band saw blades all gone and busted in half, one day me gonna weld em but until that day...



besides, me Dr. says me heart needs a daily work out...She also say a lotta other things too but me really not listening.


blessings
Padma

_________________
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Audiences and dispensations on Thursdays ~ by appointment only.


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Thank you Fillipo


DELETED !!!!

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

If there is any democratic process here Wud, I for one feel no booting is necessary as there is no conflict with any other sponsor. However, I think a reprimand be in order for not coming out with this sooner! Have you got a web link by any chance.

Cheerio

+1. I use a 1/2" Tri-Master on my souped up Delta 14" (the widest blade the frame can get to even moderate tension), and have no inclination or perceived need to look anywhere else.

_________________
Jim Kirby
kirby@udel.edu

Heh, that looks like work! I gotta improve my hand saw skills before I could do that.

_________________
Jim Kirby
kirby@udel.edu

Dare you go, hustlen yer stuff off on the brotherin

...good for you duder.


blessings

Padma

_________________
.

Audiences and dispensations on Thursdays ~ by appointment only.


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Tell ya what, I will get Tim Lory involved so we can get to the bottom of this. If it's confusion and so on, he will clear it up.

Mike

If those Laguna blades really are carbide tipped - it could simply be a case of them sharpening them with the wrong angles for carbide.... That would be my suspicion if they were going dull too fast.....

Carbide has many wonderful properties - but taking a very fine angle cutting edge isn't one of them... Sharpen the teeth with the same cutting angles you would use with HSS or CS and you will have a dull blade the first time that carbide touches anything hard/tough..... This is a problem with every carbide tipped cutting tool... Unfortunately, it's also something that both Laguna and their vendor should be familiar with if they are a "Player" in the carbide resaw blade market....

They may have tried to make a pointier tooth to require less power during the resaw so they could outfit smaller saws with Carbide.... Maybe they figured most folks would be cutting Maple, Pine, Poplar, and Spruce... and ended up with a really pointy but very brittle blade tooth... Who knows.... It should be easy enough to re-profile the carbide tips so they cut right, though.... That may be why Todd got a blade back from them that cut really nice.... They probably just "re-sharpened" it back to a "Conventional" profile which works great on the hard/tough woods we like to cut....

If I already owned the blade and had nothing else to loose - I might see if I could get it resharpened by a local saw sharpening company using cutting angles that are "Conventional" for carbide blades.... It would likely require reprofiling the entire cutting tooth - but would be worth it....

Thanks

For what it is worth, I have a message into Tim Lory at Laguna to look at this.

Mike

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Just for information's sake and not to argue, my opinion based on my experience..........

Laguna RK blades will cut ebony and other dense species perfectly straight and flat if EVERYTHING is the system is set up correctly.
To get the cut on extra dense wood all possible adjustments must be perfect, even the ones that seem like they should not be adjusted.
The blade must be perfectly sharp and the teeth in perfect alignment. The blade is a little delicate and if handled carelessly it can be knocked out of alignment. One bad tooth and the cut quality suffers. It might seem like Laguna should make a more durable blade but I hope they don't change it, for us it does a fantastic job as is. Handle and treat it with care, like a precision instrument, and it will perform like one.

The issue with the blade dulling in only a few inches of cut is due to incorrect saw alignment and improper feed speed, pressure and stability. There are other issues that may effect the blade performance on smaller saws too.

I've used Laguna for years and in the beginning I experienced their poor customer service personally, extremely frustrating, but I stuck with it and now they have resolved those old problems. I must say over the last year and a half Laguna's customer service has been excellent, as good as anyone could expect.

Here is a link to Slicing Black and White Ebony video at a rate of 3 feet per minute on our FB page..........
http://www.facebook.com/#!/video/video. ... 6336688219

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Lance Peck

There is one thing going on in the bandsaw blade industry that alot of people are not aware of . In the last 5-6 years the cost of scrap steel has skyrocketed and the " Quality " of all steels has suffered . I have had more people in the last 5 yrs ( machine shop customers ) complaining that steel is no where near the quality that it was 10 yrs ago ..... Point ? it affects the steel that is being used to manufacture bandsaw blades as well . While it can and probably is a Blade issue , its not always from a poor application or sharpening , it can just be a bad run of steel . Even Lennox has had 1 particular line of blades that have had toooth strippage in steel .

Just an FYI

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

There is a problem with these blades. I bought one, it was so wonderful, it seemed it could cut anything, bubinga, Hondo rosewood, ziricote, my 50 yr old eyes could hardly see the saw marks. I loved it so much I ordered a second blade within 2 weeks of receivng the first. I continued using that first blade for 6 more months until I hit a nail- not at an angle- but literally perfectly parallel to the blade. I put on my 2nd, brand new blade, and it would not even cut the very first piece of mahogany straight. Of course, I assumed there was something wrong with my saw and spent many hours going over every aspect of my resawing before trying a different blade. By then I had wasted about a week of time and was so thoroughly poofed that I did not feel like complaiing(blood pressure too high). I had sent the nail hit blade in immediately, and when it returned it sawed good. It did break at the weld about 1 month later. I should have called and complained about the 1 rotten blade and the weld breakage, but never did. Just got sick of the overpriced stuff they sell- The blades really are 1.73/inch. If both blades would have really been the same, I would have felt they were worth the price. The way it turned out, just seemed like a whole bunch of headache/heartache. So many headaches, I would rather use a disston D8, ala the padma.

I just got off the phone with Tim Lory at Laguna. He has expressed a sincere interest in assisting anyone here with problems they may have with their Laguna blades. Filippo, he really wants to help you in particular. He knows you are a customer from the past (you are in their databases).

According to Tim, Laguna blades are made from Uddeholm Swedish steel. The tips are carbide, applied by a company named CET in Germany. Bandstock is sent to Laguna for grinding and sharpening. The RK blades I use are variable pitch, 3 TPI? Cannot remember. They are quite sharp and quite agressive. Very smooth cuts. I have cut a bunch of hard stock and not seen the problems you mention. My bandsaw is 3hp, with 18" wheels. I do use the Laguna Driftmaster fence for resaw work.

(800) 234-1976 ext. 9665 (Tim Lory)

Please call Tim if you want to get to the bottom of your problem. I am putting you in touch with a guy who will do everything reasonable to help resolve your problem. Give this a shot.

Mike

I will be giving Tim a call also. I have 2 Resaw King blades that are no use to me, plus another brand new unused one that I'm not even bothered to try.

The first one cut a few pieces of softer wood just fine, but failed completely after cutting about 4 sides off an 8" billet of cocobolo. Like others above, I assumed it was my saw set up (it's a Laguna SE20 with a driftmaster fence). I spent ages setting it up again (and found that it was actually set up right the first time), put on a new RK blade and tried to resaw the rest of my coco. It wasn't having any of it. The second blade went dull after cutting less than 2 sides. I called Laguna about the problem. The guy there told me I probably didn't have enough tension on the blade (that's nonsense, of course!) and didn't seem to want to help me further. Therefore I have to side with Fillipo on this one. These RK blades are crap. Maybe they are from a bad batch? Who knows? I know I will never buy another one, ever.

I took the advice of others online and ordered a couple of Lenox Woodmaster CT blades. I've had one of these on the SE20 for several months now and it's been no problem whatsoever. It cuts coco like butter. The cuts are nice and straight and clean, needing just a slight sanding before use (sometimes I don't bother sanding at all before using the cut wood).

Dave F.

_________________
Cambrian Guitars

"There goes Mister Tic-Tac out the back with some bric-brac from the knick-knack rack"

I hate to throw more wood on the fire here but.......................

Tonight I changed out my Woodmaster CT to the freshly sharpened Resaw King......I received it back from Laguna about 4 months ago...didn't open the box...and just put it up on the shelf. I found some really nice Mahogany that is to be back and side sets. Guess what...the cut quality is not what it was when it was new. Noticeably more rough as if a tooth or two might have a snag on it...a light snag but still a snag. It's not the baby skin smooth finish it produced before. On par with my Woodmaster CT (which ain't bad but.....).

Anyway - I might call him, might not. I have so many things going right now. I really didn't expect to get the blade back and discover a lower quality of cut.



Just as a recap, I posted a comparison a while back -> http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=32045

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There is no difference between the man that thinks he can....and the man that thinks he cannot.

Based on conversations with Tim, I'm thinking it might be useful to post the following about your situation:

Bandsaw brand, wheel size, and hp
When you bought the blade, and from whom (I'm guessing this should, for the most part, be Laguna)
Blade width
The type of fence you use
The type of guides you use

the last three are informative only

Mike

Thats It IM DONE !!!!!

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Just for the record... I had nothing to do with a "drive by" PM in case ANYBODY else was wondering... you kind of left that hanging Filippo. And if my posts are considered "drive-by", thats not accurate. I have been following this and trying to get information and assistance. Did you take advantage of any of it? Did you call Tim?

wasnt a PM Fillipo its on the other thread .


And Lifes to short to be caught up in the Petty BS !

Thanks for your recomendation . If people want to talk to me they can , if not thats ok to . Both times I have considered the posiblity of working toward being a sponser here this crap has happened ...... so why bother .

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Wud, I mean you NO harm. Everything you sell, you can sell in the classifieds. Everybody knows you sell. What has happened here is you have gotten yourself wrapped up in an ill-intentioned thread, one that should never have been started on this forum.

I repeat. It's the bashing of a company that ticks me off... especially when I know dam well the blades are good, if not some of the best.

Mike is the company they are bashing a sponser here ? I figured they must be since you are so set on defending them by name and also providing a contact etc: Ive looked , maybe im missing something !

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

No, they are not a sponsor. But I have argued in the past that bashing any company is bad form on the OPEN forum. Lance has provided mechanisms here for that type of discussion. However, I would defend them anyways because I have NEVER seen the problems they are talking about. So what should I do? Let them bash a product that I love, and incidentally, promote? I get nothing out of it. Just like I love Taylor & Martin guitars. I promote them because they are a great product. I can hardly imaginge ANY company out there that deserves this type of bashing. Most companies understand that if they are providing crap, they won't be in business long. It's self correcting. I have provided contact info for a guy at Laguna who will take these issues seriously and help resolve them. Maybe, Filippo will call Tim. If I had invested in three laguna blades that did not work, I sure as heck would. They are not inexpensive.

Mike

Good point Jim H . Sorry , your right !

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/

Can you guys take this stuff to PM's please?

I come here to read and talk about Lutherie.

If you have an issue with the way the board is run, or with an individual poster, take it up with the appropriate individuals privately. Don't air your dirty laundry out here for everyone else to smell.

_________________
Jim Hansen