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By "sounds awful" I meant the deal, not the description of it. Risky. Again, good luck to you.

Mike

Personally I would have stopped at the followng quote "All he said was he'd rather have a small local builder have it than a bigger company like santa Cruz" These sort of statements from of a seller you do not know of anything are 99.9% bullsh*t. Also why would you trust a third party seller of the wood (the hardware store guy) who would rather look out for small local builders he does not know rather than the owner of the wood he does know?

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http://www.Harvestmoonguitars.com

This wood does not exhibit any of the color and texture typical of Brazilian rosewood.
It is far more consistant with that typical of Indian rosewood.
My policy for buying Brazilian rosewood from a photo or two on the internet has always been that if the photos don't show unmistakable "smoking gun" Brazilian characteristics,
I won't buy it.

This doesn't.

Even if the wood was purchased in 1969, wouldn't you still need a dated receipt for CITIES proof? I would be looking for a 10' pole with an extension on this deal.

Alex

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"Indecision is the key to flexibility" .... Bumper sticker

I guess it does sound risky. But comparing it to Cocobolo, it's not because I know Cocobolo, and it was standing right next to EIR boards and it's not even close to those. I've seen many different EIR but this "Brazilian" deffinately isn't. As for what it is exactly, I think I should contact the owner if I'll still be interesting. At first it was exciting, now kinda intimidating, so I might as well stay away.

We'll see. Thanks guys

Ok guys so if this is not Brazilian Rosewood and I do get it, I will have some expensive non BR lying around in my shop. And if it IS the real stuff, I'll need either proof that it was purchased before the ban, and if I can't get proof, then I'll need to get The paperwork for it if I ever plan to sell a guitar out it?

Hello,
I am from europe, so I have to calculate in Euros and m³, sorry for that, BUT:

100 dollar for one BF is about 42322$ for a m³
This would be about about 30200 Euro / m³, thats not cheap, thats an average to expensive price, for good Brazilian with paperwork.

Your fotos look like Brazilian to me, new growth, fresh cut an illegal ebay Brazilian from 2000 to 2005, I could even tell you the name of the guy selling it in these years, but i wont.

Any selling, buying and even owning Brazilian Rosewood, without proper CITES Paperwork is illegal, worlwide in every country.
Best regards, Alex

That looks like Kingwood to me. Far from commanding 100$/bd. ft....

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I'd like to be able to prove, just for once, that money wouldn't make me happy...

Filippo, thanks for the reply. If I WOULD get this, it would be a small amount. Remember these are 4/4 and so I'd get about 32" of the narrower board for sides and 21" for backs of the wider piece. There is a guy in town that will cut it up for me if I do get it. He's done soundboards before. If that won't work, I'll look out of town. And also about the kingwood, this was deffinagely not it. There was kingwood there that I compared it to. And guys I'm not trying to sell anything to anyone, I'm just trying to figure out with your help if this is the real stuff. I looks a lot better in real life. Once again, thaks everybody for the help and input.

You have had a number of true experts on this subject post about this wood. I have been using Brazilian Rosewood for over 11 years. If you want to get some real Brazilian rosewood , I can get you in touch with legal dealers . A true luthier grade set will cost well over $500.00 anything less than that may be brazilian but would be questionable quality for building purposes .
I think that you are best to make up your own mind to buy it but know it is illegal and if you get caught it isn't worth it.

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John Hall
blues creek guitars
Authorized CF Martin Repair
Co President of ASIA
You Don't know what you don't know until you know it

Of course if we start looking at the cost of a B&S set of any wood, one can recognize that there are approximately 1.4 bf per set, and if you have a set that costs $500, that's almost $360 / bf. lol.... so $100/bf for good & legal brazilian is actually a good price.

BTW, "Old growth" Brazilian comes in many colors (soil mineral content) and with different figure, depending on conditions, soil, and region. I once had some old growth wood that exhibited some stripey qualities similar to those pictures that was fantastic wood. But this wood doesn't look right to me. In fact, it looks a LOT like the crap some guy has been passing off in eBay as Brazilian, that is probably Pau Ferro (Bolivian Rosewood, not a true rosewood) or something like that. What's that old adage? If it seems too good to be true....well, you get it.

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"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Quite honestly, when I looked at the pictures, Pau Ferro or Striped Ebony immediately came to mind, not Brazilian Rosewood.

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Old growth, shmold growth!

As long as the wood remains in the US, CITES is not an issue.
I have been cutting BR for guitars since 1981, and that wood does not look like BR to me. Even if it were, that quality is mediocre, and IMHO not worth the price. I cannot imagine Santa Cruz (or any other established luthier) sticking with a $100 per board foot offer after actually seeing the wood.
Buyer beware.
The ban that occurred in 1969 is not related to CITES in any way. At that time the Brazilian government imposed an embargo on export of round logs. As a result, there was very little BR lumber on the market all through the 1970's, but veneer was readily available. Then in 1981, I found that veneer backers were being exported. They are center cut boards that are a byproduct of the veneer making process. Around 1984, squared logs of new growth BR started showing up. From that time until the CITES ban in 1992, nearly all the BR I cut was from those squared logs. At that time, the average price was between $15 and $20 per board foot.

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John

Filippo,

I have a bridge I would like to sell you. :p

Mike

Thank you, Don.
I have a piece of Bolivian that I made a git stand out of,
but couldn't remember the name.
Looks just like that.

What Filippo said "sand it and smell it !!! thern you will know "if you smelled BZ before that is..

Lars

If its in lumber form, I don't think you just claim it was cut before the ban, there's no way to document that. So the way things are going with CITES you may be setting yourself up for a lot of hassle. I'm not a lawyer and certainly could be wrong.

Edit: I didn't see all these post on page two. It looks like I'm a little late with my thoughts on this as others have stated the basically the same thing.

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Jim Watts
http://jameswattsguitars.com

I agree, it looks like PF to me.

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I certainly wouldn't buy it and I would advise you not too either. There are far better alternatives (Indian Rosewood for example) that will look much prettier and not cost as much. I think you have gotten more than enough feedback to make your decision. At this point, the rest is up to you.

Best of Luck,
Simon

Yep, no pores, and no worm holes.

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I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/

All righty guys. After carefully examining each and every single post, I have come to a conclusoin. I went and bought it ALL!!!!!



LOL Just kidding

I took Joel Stehr down there, and he did the sniff test, he has a stash at home and knows exactly what it smells like, and after smelling it, he couldn't tell for sure. He said it felt like it and that it was similar (and it does have pores) but he said he wouldn't get it. So we chatted at the store for a while and went back home

Thanks a lot everybody for all the opinions and insight, the verdict stands:

not a true Brazilian Rosewood

Happy building everyone!

I'm hijacking your thread!

Pictures of the French rosewood are up at the other place...

http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.y ... ion?page=2

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i know the party is almost over by now, but shouldn´t pau-ferro / morado / bolivian RW / santos RW be lighter in colour? just asking for enlightenment´s sake.

thanks,
miguel.

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member of the guild of professional dilettantes

Dalbergia nigra is the chameleon of rosewoods, it can have diverse and sometimes very different appearance. Colour, grain pattern, figure, you name it. Then there is old and more recent growth.

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Laurent Brondel
West Paris, Maine - USA
http://www.laurentbrondel.com/

Whatever it is, that is quite a pile of good sized planks !

lots of pith cuts with plenty of checking.

-jd