Official Luthiers Forum!

Hi,
I am not a luthier, so I don't know if I am even allowed to post here! My apologies if I am not
allowed! Anyway, I needed some help with fixing a loose brace, so I thought maybe this could be the right place to ask for help.
I live in India, and recently bought a Martin D-15. When I got it, there was a loose back brace. We do
not have authorised Martin repair guys, so I just asked the dealer through whom I got it to get his tech guy to fix it. He did, and the brace is in place. However, he apparently missed an adjacent brace, which is less obviously loose, but still results in irritating buzzes and rattles. I was told that with proper
direction, this is something I can fix on my own, so I thought I should try, with a little help here.
These are pictures of the brace, along with that of the brace which was glued




As you can see, there is a small crevice between the end of the brace and the guitar back, seen as a 'shadow'.
I have got hold of the following contraption from Stewmac:




I have also ordered for 'Titebond Original Wood Glue', and I should get it sometime soon.

I was thinking about doing it as follows:

(1) Put the Stewmac contraption in place, without tightening it
(2) Put some kind of a C-clamp, which can open more than the guitar's body depth, with one end on the back of the guitar, the other on the top, opposite to the points where the Stemac thing rests on the brace, and on the guitar top. I place light pressure with the clamp.
(3) I put some glue under the brace end with a feeler gauge, and tighten the Stewmac jack till the brace is in place and I can see some glue ooze out. I do NOT put any additional pressure with the external clamp, the pressure due to the internal jack being automatically balanced by the clamp, since it
has all along been in contact with the guitar back and top.
(4) Wipe excess titebong glue with a damp cloth
(5) Let the whole thing dry up.

Is this the way to go about it? If not, I will really appreciate the correct directions! Also, how long does one keep the brace and the guitar under this pressure, with Titebond glue?
Thanks, and apologies again, if I am not welcome!

Abhinav,
First of all, you are most welcome here on the OLF. this is a place for all levels of people interested in guitar building and repairs. Be warned, if you hang around here long enough, and even if you just want to fix your current instrument, you will probably get the "bug" and not want to stop there.
As for your particular problem, I'm afraid I can't risk telling you what to do because I've never repaired a loose brace but there are plenty of guys here who have and I'm sure they will be eager to help you.
Good luck,

René

Abhinav,

As Rene said, you are certianly welcome on the forum.
Your concept on how to repair your brace is correct. Don't forget to use cork or some similar material with the clamp on the outside of your guitar to protect the finish. Do you know the age of your guitar? It will help the repair guys on the forum to guide you in the correct adhesive selection for the repair.

Steve

Abhinav -

Welcome!

Anyway, caveat first. I'm not a repair expert (in fact I'm not any kind of expert when it comes to luthiery, just an eager novice.) You'll certainly get some very experienced advice from others here.

The one bit of advice which instantly occurs to me is that you'll need some very good cauls with soft, absorbent edges between the clamp and the top and back of the guitar. Easy to put a seam in the top of a guitar - don't ask me how I know. After applying the glue, you'll need it to be tight, but not too tight. Don't risk cracking a brace or the top. Snug, not supertight.

For what it's worth, I think your approach makes sense.

That "titebong" glue sounds pretty good, although I don't think it's available in the US. Might bring a whole new level of creativity to my guitar building.

I've done quite a few of these repairs myself. It's a bit disturbing to me to see the sloppy repair of the one brace but if it holds then thats great. If you are inclined and can get inside the sound hole easily then you can scrape that away but it's a lot of work. I am fortunate to have long skinny arms, in a lot of guitars I can actually tickle the tail block Titebond will work fine if you can open the crack up enough to be able message it in there. Some people will wick a little water in the crack first to draw the glue in but don't use a whole lot of water. The good thing about tightbond is it's so easy to clean up and it gives you time to get the clamps right.

Your first repair is with CA and it's a good glue to use but it can be tricky and messy or it can be really simple. If you can close that cracked gap with finger pressure then CA might be a good choice. Just line the area with tape first and then get some thin CA in the crack and hold it tight for 60 seconds. Follow that up with your little jack for good measure. Also you can use plexy glass pieces on the outside of your guitar for the jack reinforcement as you described.

I must have done well over a hundred of these repairs and I've never seen one come back broken. It's pretty simple and common. Good luck.

Thanks you all so much! This seems like a really warm place, and I'm really delighted to be welcome here . I realize that I will need to put some kind of padding between the clamp and the guitar body! Just curious---will a small book do? I have lots of them at hand, thats all! I'm a teacher by profession.
The guitar is new, as in I got it first hand. The serial no. suggests that it was manufactured sometime in late 2007. I've got it from the Indian Martin distributor, who is good at distributing Martins, but not so good at fixing them! So, I though I might as well try it myself, if it is simple and safe enough.
I have ordered for Titebond from the U.K, though I know it is available in the U.S., you can get it at Stewmac.
By the way, if one uses Titebond, how long should I have all the reinforcement in place--the jack, clamp and all?

I'm curious to why you would need to c clamp anything....can't you just glue then jack and be done with it?

I leave my stuff for a full day before removing anything.

Abhinav-
Welcome to the OLF!
You have gotten lots of good suggestions here for doing the repair yourself.
Years ago I lived/worked in India and have travelled back a number of times. I also watched from time-to-time as my sitar was being built in Varanasi in the late 60s.
You live in Delhi; I believe you will find some traditional sitar/tanpura builders in Delhi who could probably do this repair for you. You would likely find that one of those craftsmen would use a small stick as a prop to hold things in place while the glue set. Fresh Titebond-type glue will work, but probably a traditional local glue would be a better choice in my opinion.
You will also find that good-quality 'white' or 'yellow' glues are available locally- no need to import everything. Just test the glue before using- it should dry to a hard and fairly clear residue.

You will need to protect your Martin from Delhi's climate - a few dry seasons followed by the monsoon will do a lot of damage, so keeping it as dry as possible will increase its life.
For non-Indians- Delhi weather summary:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/results.shtml?tt=TT002240

Just my 'two paisa worth' here. You will get lots of (conflicting) ideas on every topic here at the OLF- part of the fun.

Cheers
John

You need an outside clamp to counter the pressure of the jack. Without one, you're risking deforming or even cracking the top, back, or other braces. Note that the clamping pressure does not need to be too great -- if you see good squeeze-out, you have enough glue and enough pressure. A couple of fairly thin books would probably be good cauls to protect the surfaces and spread the load though I like cork glued to wood or plexiglass. It's easy on the finish.

Ahh that's why u need an outside clamp...I didn't think it would distort it to much because it doesn't take much pressure to re glue a brace.... but this is why i'm an amateur.

No actually you are correct. this brace by looking at the picture appears to be a simple one and probably won't require a lot of force. But it's always better safe then sorry.

I keep Tightbond joints in clamps for at least one hour then let it completely dry over night. Or just leave it clamped over night

Ah, I've really got a wealth of information here! JohnAbercrombie, thank you too for your 'local wisdom'
about the place where I live. Yes, Delhi weather can be extreme, so I will try to take care of the guitar
as well as I can. The guitar stays in its case when I am not playing it, and the 'climate' indoors will not be as extreme as outside. Anyway, I am getting hold of a digital hygrometer to monitor the humidity levels before monsoons arrive. In these parts, we do not use room dehumidifiers, just live with the humidity, when its there (which is about 7 months)! So, I will need some kind of an 'in-case' dehumidifier during the humid days. Any 'in-case' solutions to control high humidity??