Official Luthiers Forum!

If you guys truly are interested in this stuff and how it bears on what we do....

Check out the Fresh Water Aquarium folks and the Orchid folks... Not only are they having to deal with this legal hassle... but they are trying to keep things alive while it is all going on... These guys know more than you ever wanted to know about CITES and Lacey...

The main place you can get hung out to dry is buying stuff through shady connections... I see BRW as a prime opportunity on this, as there is so much demand for this "Unobtanium"... and if it seems like it is too good to be true... it probably is.... The other instance is anywhere massively politically unstable... Madagascar, Burma, etc.

I am guessing that LMI, Stew Mac, Allied and such, along with the big hitters in the specialty hardwood lumber industry are trying pretty hard to stay aboveboard... You aren't going to get arrested for buying a Mahogany board at your local Woodcraft store....

Export can be tough, though... If I was building a guitar specifically for Export -- I would try my best to make sure I had all the Paperwork before I started the commission... You may pay more for FSC certified stock or whatever... but you also have a papertrail for getting the proper permits.

Thanks

John

Since this directly applies to us, I don't think the usual politics rule applies. As long as it doesn't turn into a Democrats this, or Republicans, that kind of thing we should be ok.

I think legitimate conversations about policy, enforcement, etc. should be ok.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

What am I doing to prepare for the Lacey Act - Nothing! What do I plan on doing as a result of the Lacey act - Nothing!

What I am wondering and have been wondering since the inception of this thread is if the OP has any suggestions for us and also if they may in fact be an attorney? Not that there's anything wrong with that mind you.....

This law strikes me as too vague to be enforceable. (I mean that literally -- there is a constitutional doctrine called "vagueness" which states that criminal laws must be worded clearly enough that an ordinary person will know what kind of conduct is and is not permitted.)

With that said, buy from reputable suppliers. And if some of your suppliers haven't been reputable in the past, maybe use that wood to make guitars for yourself and your family members.

The OP is a dealer in fine guitars, among other things, including building.

http://www.zavaletas-guitarras.com/

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Waddy

Photobucket Build Album Library

Sound Clips of most of my guitars

Kelby, it is enforceable. It's the same law that controlled traffic in bald eagle feathers, ivory, and the like.

Maybe I'm mis understanding the Lacey Act, but if I'm understanding it correctly it will affect shipping (or taking) guitars across international borders. I'm my understanding is correct it will probably be the end of my international sales.

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I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/

It may not be the end of your international sales, but it would likely affect what woods your international guitars are made of.
What I'd like to know is if this policy will be backdated. What I mean is, will I be able to bring a guitar, let's say an 80's Les Paul just chock full of mahogany (I think anyway) across the border without difficulties, (or at least no more than the usual ones), while the hypothetical exact repro that I'm gonna build the day after the Lacey Act comes into effect will require documentation demonstrating compliance?
And no one has answered this either, I believe, what about the stacks and stacks of wood we all have stashed already? Is it all suddenly unusable (in a compliance/technical sense) because we can't get back dated compliance papers? What in &*% are they expecting us to actually do?
As for the future, the importers which supply us will have to have their papers in order in order to business at all. So it would seem likely to me (not being a lawyer of course) that simply buying from a reputable dealer would demonstrate a reasonable level of due diligence on a persons part. After all, we can't be expected to parachute in and cut the dang things down ourselves can we. We have day jobs for crying out loud!

Most laws when passed are not enforced in retro. it seems to me this is to eliminate the " well I thought ( or they told me ) the stuff was legal" defence.
this country is realy getting carried away with this stuff, a major problem with having lawyers write and pass the laws . I just found out today , to apply for the presidents " making homes affordable" you basicly need a lawyer, or someone with a strong "contract law" background to go in and argue your case ! because the banks are not just giving away low interest rates to people that are struggling . Jody

I moved to Canada...