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I'm just finding this whole process eye-opening. I have some knowledge of tools and wood (i made one of those corner shelves in shop once and a few bluebird houses) but i am a far cry from being a craftsman, and i am finding this process pretty darn amazing.

Last week, based on the recommendation of someone here, i went to home depot (gift card - Yay!) and picked up a 2x8x8 KD spruce board. I cut a section off and split it into braces. It was simply amazing to me how the whole thing started to make sense when trying to get some nice quartered pieces. I probably ended up with 50% waste, but i was happy that i understood what i was i was getting out of it. Now, if i ever by real brace wood, i'll be able to see the difference if there is any and understand why (or why not) it is better to buy wood specifically for that purpose.

Last night I put the radius on the braces with a plane and shooting board (Thanks Mario!) and it went nicely. I then started on the latice work of the lower bout and after a couple of tweeks on the mitre saw i got the angle down nice and tight. I should have done the first cut on some waste wood as there's a little bit of slop in the first joint, but not too bad. The rest were nearly dead on and the lattice holds together without glue (but i'll use some anyway!).

Hopefully this weekend i'll get the braces glued on. Much depends on whether i break down and decide to build a radius dish or not for gluing, and most of that decision depends on the weather and if it's warm enough to do that messy work out in the garage or not.

Anyway, the comment is that along with learning what to do, i am learning what not to do (again). Pretty durn cool.

I know there's a thirst for pictures and i will post the top for critique when it's all together. I may post it in the Sow's ear to silk purse thread as well, although mine is more like a sow's ear to a really nice sow's ear...

Thanks for the patience in dealing with my questions!

Rob

Rob,I think what you did is just great.The best way to get good wood is to prepare it yourself, that's what i do.That way you know exactly what your getting.I start with the tree.I can tell from looking at the bark what i'm going to get in wood most times.I also can make sure that the tree was growing straight and not under any tension.I can also control the way it is milled to get no runout as well,which is very important. It's hard to tell from just looking at a board how it was treated as it was cut and imposible to know if the tree was under tension while growing unless you harvest it yourself.

Depending on how long it was sitting, "new wood" from Lowes could shrink quite a bit also. I use QS cedar for jigs and stuff, but I leave it for 6 months minimum to get most of the water out. That stuff can be wet, unless no one bought it for a while.

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Here is what a Parlor Guitar is for!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEa8PkjO6_I

I was wondering about that.... even though it's kiln dried?

Would it help to bake it? Do i risk shrinking the wood where the joint's wont fit?
(Darn! that reminds me i wanted to bake the top... *sigh* next one)

If i decide not to bake it, how long should i keep it to acclimate? I was thinking that the week it has sat would be enough for the humidity/temperatue in my home but that's only if it was correctly dried to start with.

If i do bake it how long and what temp? Should i use some tobasco sauce to give it some Zing!?

Hey Rob,
I recently was looking around the MIMF library and if you search baking soundboards you should find a post a while back ( june 2005) about putting soundboards in the oven at or slightly above 213f for 1 hour. 213f is the temperature water boils at ( I think, I work in celcius and don't know the conversion off the top of my head!) and if you keep it in there for 1 hour it should bring the moisture content to around 0. The wood was then left to re acclimatize for 2 weeks ( if i remember correctly).

anyways the results seemed interesting with an increase in stiffness and a decrease in the effect of humidity changes on the wood.

I have never done this so am just relying on what i read but from what was mentioned in that forum it seemed to have some interesting positives.

Matt

but I also would like to learn more about this so if anybody has any experience doing this feel free to chime in!

I think learning how to voice a top is where you are going to get real results not baking it. I've been reading some articals about Manuel Velazquez in AL and on the web. The heart of getting it to sound good is in voicing the top. At least that's what I have always thought and that is pretty much what Manuel says. That's why the braces and everything on the top is important as it's all about voicing.
Pretty cool getting a lot of braces from Lowes ain't it?
There is a diffence in stiffness between some of the spruces. I got some from Shane that I liked and I had some red spruce which is also somewhat different. It be nice to live somewhere that you could cut your own tree.

Chris, I agree with your baking comment for the most part. The topwood i am using to play with though is stored in a leaky barn and i don't know how dry it is. It wasn't the nicest wood to start with so anything would help - probably the best thing i could do to improve the tone is to throw it out.

I was more wondering about the bracewood. I was thinking that because this was kiln dried it should be halfway decently dried, and once split if i let those sit for a week they should be "fine".

Both my braces and back & sides is HD wood as will be the neck. Home depot, your guitar supply store.
Keeping with a theme, I wonder if nails would make nice bridge pins...

It's always been my understanding that kiln dry wood is very dry and that if anything it will take on some moisture because it's drier then air dried wood. And I think the idea of baking the tops is to harden the woods resins and it isn't for the purpose of drying it like a kiln. I don't think you need to worry about the braces. I didn't have a problem with mine and part of the board is still out there. But I could be wrong.
Take the top wood and resaw it and sticker it if it seems wet. How long has it been in the garage? If it isn't roughten it probably is OK. Resaw it and see what you have and then go from there I say. What do you have too loose?

I usually take lumber from HD and paint the ends with a good coat of latex to minimize splitting and put it in the rafters for at least 6 months too. It stabilizes, saws cleaner and just stays put better. I have stuff up there that's a couple of years old.

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Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)

You are right! Now that you post that, i recall the whole resin issue.

The "top wood" *guffaw* is old cedar board siding and has been in the barn probably since '78' when the barn was built based on the date in the cement... There's no chance of resawing as it's already too thin. I'm just using it to play with and its obvious that i forgot why i wanted to bake it, and i think you're right that it's not needed.


So as far as the braces go, i'll continue to use them and if i do have an issue i'll dry them on the next one.

Thanks for the input...

78 ! No need to bake that. That's been aging for 31 years! You might have something there. Dress it out and glue it up and install rosette.

If you have a thickness caliber (1000's) you can watch the wood shrink daily if its too wet, and stored inside in winter. Mark where you measure the thickness, and what it was last time and date (on the wood)

For the first 3 months I was like WTF??

BUT they had some of that same pile a year later, I imagine most of the shrinkage was out by then.

Hint: Pick from the bottom of the pile.

_________________
Here is what a Parlor Guitar is for!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEa8PkjO6_I

I also think, it your on the 'cheap', retopping a guitar is the WAY TO GO. I think with ALL THE TOOLS you would need, you can get away with $450.00 or so. Then you can get good at tops and some repair work.

_________________
Here is what a Parlor Guitar is for!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEa8PkjO6_I

Commercial lumber that is kiln dried is done in huge stacks. The variation in dryness can be significant.

I got some 1x2 "kiln dried" lumber from Lowes five months ago. One is shaped like a hockey stick right now. Straight as an arrow for 5 1/2 feet and then hooks sharply. Most of the other pieces are still pretty darn straight. So I'm with the others, don't trust it right away, let it settle for a few months and then pick the best of it for use. Imagine what my hockey stick piece would do to a top?