Official Luthiers Forum!
https://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/

Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
https://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=49302		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  sdsollod [ Mon May 01, 2017 3:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
I'm getting ready to finish my CS-336 ...ish build. Right now I'm experimenting with colors for the flamed maple top. I'm thinking of hand applying transtint black, perhaps at 10 or 25 drops per oz. Sanding to accentuate the curl and then following that with blue at 25 drops per oz. In my trials I had hand applied the blue to see what it would look like. What I'm wondering is if it would look different if I spray the blue with tinted finish instead of hand applying the blue... (yes/no, good/bad) I have sprayed colors in my finish before with good results, but I haven't tried it in this manner. I'm leaning toward spraying the blue in my finish as apposed to hand applying with the transtint in water. ...The black will be hand applied so it can be sanded back...

Any thoughts or suggestions?
Author:  Clinchriver [ Mon May 01, 2017 4:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
sdsollod wrote:
I'm getting ready to finish my CS-336 ...ish build. Right now I'm experimenting with colors for the flamed maple top. I'm thinking of hand applying transtint black, perhaps at 10 or 25 drops per oz. Sanding to accentuate the curl and then following that with blue at 25 drops per oz. In my trials I had hand applied the blue to see what it would look like. What I'm wondering is if it would look different if I spray the blue with tinted finish instead of hand applying the blue... (yes/no, good/bad) I have sprayed colors in my finish before with good results, but I haven't tried it in this manner. I'm leaning toward spraying the blue in my finish as apposed to hand applying with the transtint in water. ...The black will be hand applied so it can be sanded back...

Any thoughts or suggestions?


Our local luthier's group recently had a class on hand applied colors/sunburst taught by James Condino, excellent class but..... its a little bit voodoo :mrgreen: Practice on scrap, don't be surprised if your piece of wood does not take the color your hoping for.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Mon May 01, 2017 5:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
A bit voodoo for sure, definitely takes experience. I stood next James while he did wonderful things to a mandolin neck and managed to thoroughly butcher the wood I was working with. It is beautiful when done right but if ever there was a time to practice on scrap, this would be it.
Author:  dzsmith [ Mon May 01, 2017 5:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
I've had better luck with water-thinned than alcohol thinned dye.
I'm not crazy about applying water to wood, but I apply several coats, letting each coat dry, and try not to soak the weeod.
I minimize splotches by applying a bit of water to the wood before applying the dye.
I've sprayed tinted nitro with good results, but Dyeing the wood directly can really make the figure pop.
Dan
Author:  sdsollod [ Mon May 01, 2017 6:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
My avatar shows a burst I did by spraying EM6000 tinted with transtint. I was pleased with the result. The difference this time is that I want to bring out the maple curl and so my thoughts are to hand apply black, sand back, and then spray the tinted finish (followed by clear coat). Unless someone says " no, don't do that" I think that's what I'm going to do. I think that I can control the amount I put on that way. Also, I want to do an edge burst. I definitely feel more comfortable spraying that...
Author:  Bri [ Mon May 01, 2017 7:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
Hi Steve,
I did a LP a while back using powdered aniline dyes. I found it very easy to control the color by adjusting the powder to water ratio, and applying with a stain pad.
If you spritz with plain water and sand back a few times the grain will be less prone to raising.
For this one I used amber and mahogany red, the two colors really popped it.
Remember, its easier to go darker, lighter, not so much
Author:  B. Howard [ Tue May 02, 2017 7:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
The visual effect of each method will differ....A tinted clear over a dye and sand back highlight will appear deeper and exhibit more movement than an all stain or "rubbed" finish will. Another problem with double dye on wood finishes is that the second color will start to pick up the highlight color from the wood and can get blotchy real easy....sometimes you won't notice this until the clear coat hits it.
Author:  Ruby50 [ Tue May 02, 2017 8:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
I have done this and like others I find it easier to dissolve dyes in water than in alcohol. I made 4 practice pieces out of a nice spruce 2X8 and did it over and over until I felt comfortable with it. You can sand off a session and try again - you can do this sanding on the actual piece too. Using paper towels and water you can blend things together over and over. I used a hair dryer after wetting the surface to keep water from getting too deeply into the wood. The finish will change the look from dull and a bit muddy to pretty clear and bright, so put a finish layer on your samples. If you choose either water or alcohol to dilute the dies, you can't put a brushed layer of shellac over it because it will dissolve and run - so you have to at least spray a first layer of shellac if you are putting on a brushed or wiped finish.

Can't practice enough, but it is very rewarding.

Ed
Author:  printer2 [ Tue May 02, 2017 6:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
Image

OK, I have to try this.
Author:  rlrhett [ Tue May 02, 2017 7:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
I'm no expert on this, but my hybrid approach on the last guitar was to hand rub the water/Transtint mission brown/sand back/amber. Then I applied a coat of shellac as a kind of sanding sealer. Then I used a small airbrush to apply a mission brown/black burst to the edges. It worked better than the previous guitar purely rubbed on dye, but I could just wipe off mistakes with a damp cloth.

That said, I've seen jobs where the figured maple looks like it is a balloon of rippling amber wood rising out of a deep dark pool. Wish I knew how to pull that off.
Author:  gregorio [ Tue May 02, 2017 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hand Applied Color vrs. Spraying Color
Funny others mentioned James.
Here is a link to some hand stuff.
http://www.finewoodworking.com/2007/12/ ... rst-finish
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/