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| Triming the heel cap https://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=46778 |
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| Author: | Pmaj7 [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 1:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Triming the heel cap |
Seems to me it's best to attach and trim the heel cap after fitting the neck. It's always been a little awkward to chisel it down to be flush with the heel without messing with the neck fit (or going a little to far on the cap itself). The last few I think I finessed just right, but is there a sure fire way? Or do you glue it already flush and trim the other side? |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
I final fit the neck after the heel cap goes on |
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| Author: | Hesh [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
Pat I had success fitting the neck and then gluing the heel cap with the neck in place AND waxed paper between the heel, cap, and body to prevent gluing the cap and heel to the body. The neck is removed, the cap is blended in with the heel, the guitar is finished in two pieces and then I would do a final fitting of the neck after finishing. To glue the cap I would use Titebond original with a small area in the gluing surface without Titebond and a drop or two of medium CA. This gives me a few seconds to position the cap perfectly before the CA bites and provides the clamping for the Titebond. Ken and I were just talking about this a few weeks ago, using CA to clamp longer open glues. Why refit the neck after finishing? Because the fit can ever so slightly change and we want a gapless, perfect fit. The final fitting rarely requires much fitting at all but since the neck joint is often looked at by folks we want it perfect. I typically would go to 220 paper for final fitting. |
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
I attach the heelcap before final neck fit. I use an angle finder to get the angle of the back compared to the neck block, so that the heel cap is in plane with the back. I use the angle finder to set the mitre gauge on the edge sander. Then I sand the heelcap area of the neck to the right length, then sand the angle into the edge of the heelcap that will touch the body. Then I glue the heelcap to the neck and line up the edge with a straightedge. I thinks pics will help. Standby. |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
Actually I do leave the heel cap with a slight overhang on the joint side so I can final fit it when the joint is fitted... But when gluing the neck in I also (with the guitar in an unfinished state) glue the heel cheek to the body with a bit of titebond. The heel is also clamped in with a long clamp to close the gap. The bond there won't be strong enough to prevent future resets but it does help fill in any microscopic gap and springieness that the heel can sometimes have. I got no idea how factories does this but I have seen evidence that major manufacturers such as Martin also do this. The guitar is then finished with the neck on. When the neck needs to come off the end grain small area glue joint usually pops off when the dovetail works loose. I've had to do this on one occassion (wrong neck angle) and it works. |
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 4:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
 Find angle  Set mitre gauge  Sand heel down to length  Sand angle into heelcap  Line up with edge using a straight edge  Glue and tape it on  Doublecheck. Also, I always set my necks about 1/32" forward, as it's much easier to bring them back than forward. Then during final fit, I floss out that tiny amount so it ends up where I want it. |
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| Author: | J De Rocher [ Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
Hesh wrote: Pat I had success fitting the neck and then gluing the heel cap with the neck in place AND waxed paper between the heel, cap, and body to prevent gluing the cap and heel to the body. The neck is removed, the cap is blended in with the heel, the guitar is finished in two pieces and then I would do a final fitting of the neck after finishing. This is exactly how I do it too. |
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| Author: | Terence Kennedy [ Sun Dec 06, 2015 1:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
I fit the neck and fine tune the angle before gluing the cap. I have a belt sander jig that I use to flatten and fine tune the length and angle. It works better than it looks. I glue the cap as a last step. Put some adhesive backed sandpaper on the area of the body it will butt against and sand any slight radius if needed before gluing. A few flosses after gluing if needed.    
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Sun Dec 06, 2015 2:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
We're doing pretty much the same thing, except I'm horizontal, you're vertical... |
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| Author: | Colin North [ Sun Dec 06, 2015 7:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
I floss the neck joint first, then I set the angle at the heel to match the angle of the back, fit it loosely to the body and insert a thick enough plastic shim to leave clearance for the thickest abrasive I want to use between neck and body, then tighten the bolts (M & T). I then floss the heel cap against the body to accommodate any curvature, and the angle, with strips of abrasive, then refit the neck to the body with greaseproof paper between, and glue the cap in place. Trim with a chisel to fit to the heel before a final light sand of the area. I re-floss the joint after finishing, 240 grit, and it only requires a touch up. |
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| Author: | Rod True [ Sun Dec 06, 2015 7:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
The heel cap is the very last thing I glue onto the neck. I set the neck before attaching the fretboard, then double check after the board is attached getting the neck as perfectly set as I can. Then I place some sand paper behind the neck, bolt it on and sand the heel cap to the body profile. Unbolt the neck and replace the sand paper with wax paper, then glue the heel cap on. It's a perfect fit every time. |
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| Author: | Pmaj7 [ Wed Dec 09, 2015 11:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
Wow so many brilliant ideas that I had never thought of. I usually overthink things, but this time I was way under thinking! I really appreciate all the input! Am I right in assuming ya'll are using ca? Whenever I have used regular glue and clamp, it wants to slide forward. I like the hesh-hybrid idea, but seems like it would only be suitable on a large cap. |
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| Author: | J De Rocher [ Wed Dec 09, 2015 1:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
pat macaluso wrote: Wow so many brilliant ideas that I had never thought of. I usually overthink things, but this time I was way under thinking! I really appreciate all the input! Am I right in assuming ya'll are using ca? Whenever I have used regular glue and clamp, it wants to slide forward. I like the hesh-hybrid idea, but seems like it would only be suitable on a large cap. I use LMI glue. I clamp it as in the photo and the clamps pull the heel cap snug against the body. There's a piece of wax paper between the neck and the body. This exact setup with these clamps might not work for small heel caps, but maybe something similar could be worked out. 
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| Author: | Quine [ Thu Dec 10, 2015 1:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
I glue my caps on at about the last stage of neck carving. I leave the heel a bit long while carving....I found that the bottom of the heel can get dented or rounded at the edges while handling in carving, then I wouldn't have a clean joint at the edge of the cap. Usually when I switch from chisels to sanding, I cut the heel to length and glue on the cap. I fit the neck with the cap installed |
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| Author: | Rod True [ Thu Dec 10, 2015 5:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
I use CA to glue my cap on. Quick and easy and I don't worry about it getting into the end grain of the heel as the wood needs to have the pores filled anyway. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Thu Dec 10, 2015 10:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
Titebond for me! |
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| Author: | Pmaj7 [ Sat Dec 12, 2015 2:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
meddlingfool wrote: Titebond for me! Do you do some kind of clamp like Jay, to pull it back against the body?
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Sat Dec 12, 2015 3:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Triming the heel cap |
Nope, Pictographically explanated above... |
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