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Purchasing sets
https://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=42320		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Otterhound [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 2:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Purchasing sets
The obvious standard is for sets to be offered as a defined pair of sides and backs .
I am wondering if there is interest in being able to mix and match your own from sides and backs being offered separately in order to choose your own pairings .
I am also wondering if there is any objection to this as well .
Tanks for your input .
Author:  runamuck [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
I do it.
One guitar I'm working on has a cocobolo back and curly maple sides. Another has a wenge back with curly koa sides.

It seems to me that it's tradition that has driven what we usually see.
Author:  DennisK [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
Are we talking same species, or different? I've had a few times where there were back and side sets of the same species, where I wanted to mix and match. But most suppliers do a pretty good job of matching them up already.

There's also the case that sometimes you can weedle a harp guitar 4-piece back/side set out of 3 regular guitar side sets. But that's no good if you have an equal number of backs and sides to start with.

In general, I think it's easier to keep track of if the backs and sides are matched up to begin with. People can always ask about mix-and-match if it becomes relevant.

I'm currently building a harp ukulele with mahogany back and walnut sides, but I wouldn't buy mismatched sets on purpose. I only do it when I have leftovers that look good together :)
Author:  Otterhound [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 5:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
I have a considerable amount of domestic wood that is either ready or will be very soon .
One of them is a walnut .
Lets say that I have 50 backs cut and 50 sides cut , but I want the buyer to have the option of pairing up backs and sides instead of me choosing the match up of backs and sides . I simply wish to allow the option .
Of course , there will be certain combinations that I will not break up . For example , a back and side set that are cut , side by side from a single piece of wood that will be a perfect match . I will be posting 4 maple sets like that very soon .
When I go to most vendor sites , the combinations are chosen for the purchaser .
I hope this is clear .
Author:  Michael.N. [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
That's much easier when the buyer can see the wood in person. It's easy to compare odd Backs with odd Sides. In photo's it's a bit more difficult.
Author:  meddlingfool [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 9:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
I prefer to get well matched sets. I'd hate to have to waste time trying to match sets on line, and it pisses me off when I get sets from vendors that make me think they reached the end of the pile and sent me same species leftovers....
Author:  James Ringelspaugh [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 10:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
IMO it could be difficult to judge a good match from pictures, even very detailed ones. Unless the lighting, shooting angle and distance, and point of focus are all pretty much exactly the same, even very good cameras will show some variation in color from one shot to the next. That's my experience anyway from shooting manually with a pretty nice Nikon... for lesser cameras and cameras with more smarts that use a lot of input variables to figure out color and exposure the difference can be substantial.

That's not to say it's necessarily a bad idea to offer separate backs and sides... for some wood species that are generally pretty homogeneous across boards it might not be a big deal, but for something like pau ferro or rosewoods that can be all over the place grain and color-wise it could be a real crap shoot. Just my $.02 of course...
Author:  Otterhound [ Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
Filippo Morelli wrote:
Most folks do not have enough photography chops, much less the equipment to get colors right. Often times, for sawyers handling sizable lumber, sides and backs don't come out of the same flitch. We see that a lot with Brazilian Rosewood for example.

Anyway I'm not sure what the benefit would be for me to pick which sides and backs go together. What are your thoughts on what the value of that is to the end buyer?

Filippo

The only advantage to it that I can think of is personal taste on behalf of the customer and luthier .
Author:  fingerstyle1978 [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 7:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
I understand the desire to deviate from tradition, but I have never seen a tastefully done mix of back/side material. I'm not saying it van't be done. I'm certain it can, I just haven't seen it, nor would I strive for it.

I think of it like throwing beef, chicken and pork into the same soup, I'm not saying it couldn't taste good- it's just a bit confusing. Who knows maybe Carl's Jr. will make a chicken/steak sandwich topped with bacon that will become the next American fast food favorite.

Personally I'm into matching as many woods as I can, but that's my taste and taste is certainly subjective.

However, if your goal is to save some cheddar- you can't go wrong buying orphaned back/side sets and mix and match them until your heart is content.
Author:  Otterhound [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 7:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
Just for the record , I was not suggesting mixing species . I guess that it could be done .
Thanks guys .
Author:  fingerstyle1978 [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 8:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
Otterhound wrote:
Just for the record , I was not suggesting mixing species . I guess that it could be done .
Thanks guys .


My bad, It's like 4 AM in Alaska and I just sat down for a glass or three of wine and misread the original post oops_sign
Author:  Clay S. [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
If you use the same set up and lighting ( dedicated "photo studio") and use a color standard ("grey card") in the photo people may be able to judge the color match enough to select from different photos.
Allowing customers to select backs and sides individually can have some advantages, and with domestic woods I think there is less reluctance to use stains and colorants to bring things to a better match. Try it and see how it goes.
Author:  Dave Sayers [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
I understand what you are saying but choosing from various sets only the bits you like could well leave the seller with odds that don't really match anything. Perhaps it would be best to buy a nice back and side set of one wood and another set of a different wood and then swap sides, so perhaps mahogany with walnut? That way the timber merchant doesn't lose and you get what you want.
Author:  Otterhound [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
fingerstyle1978 wrote:
Otterhound wrote:
Just for the record , I was not suggesting mixing species . I guess that it could be done .
Thanks guys .


My bad, It's like 4 AM in Alaska and I just sat down for a glass or three of wine and misread the original post oops_sign

No worries .
Author:  Otterhound [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
Dave Sayers wrote:
I understand what you are saying but choosing from various sets only the bits you like could well leave the seller with odds that don't really match anything. Perhaps it would be best to buy a nice back and side set of one wood and another set of a different wood and then swap sides, so perhaps mahogany with walnut? That way the timber merchant doesn't lose and you get what you want.

If offering this , that would be a possible cost of doing business in this fashion .
There is always waste .
Author:  Clay S. [ Sun Dec 29, 2013 6:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Purchasing sets
On the Allied lutherie site they offer back and side sets for sale separately and without pictures. I assume if you order both back and side sets they will attempt to match them up, but I don't see where there is any guarantee how well they will match.
Letting people see what they are getting I think would be a plus.
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