Official Luthiers Forum!
https://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/

Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
https://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=41552		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Steven Bollman [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 1:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
I'd like to try this joint and was wondering if anyone has Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions that they would be willing to share.

Thank you kindly!
Author:  Rodger Knox [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
There was an article in AL a few issues back, I'll check on that when I get home tonight.
There should be quite a bit in the archives, both here and over at MIMF.
Author:  Tom West [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 3:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
Steven: Don't have any sizes for you but was wondering if you know a chap by the name of Rex Tremende....??
Tom
Author:  Steven Bollman [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 6:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
Tom West wrote:
Steven: Don't have any sizes for you but was wondering if you know a chap by the name of Rex Tremende....??
Tom


Hehe. Yeah that's me on AGF. I wish I could change it. It's an old moniker.
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
I did one on a through V joint, using similar methods to Joshua French, but not birds beak, which is a bridle joint or something like that. I think Hauser used it. The V shows in the back, but does not come through the headstock piece.
Author:  Rodger Knox [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
The bridle joint is a little different. There's several variations on this joint, I remeber reading somewhere recently.
There's the through V, which is what Waddy used.
There's the covered V, which is virtually the same, except the point of the V doesn't go all the way through the headstock, it's covered by 1/8" or so of the headstock face, making it really tricky to fit. That's the one Hauser used. When fitted correctly, this design can hold string tension without being glued.
Both of those have "shoulders", there's also the option of doing either of these without shoulders, with the V extending all the way to the edge of the neck and headstock.
Then there's the bird's beak that Martin used, which is a bridle joint. Maybe Clay will chime in, he's done several of the Martin style joints.

edit: I checked through my back issues of AL and didn't find anything, maybe I read it here or over at MIMF.
duh
viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=38447&p=504840&hilit=bridle+joint#p504840
There's several more if you search bridle joint.
Author:  Clay S. [ Sat Oct 05, 2013 7:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
Hi Steven,
What dimensions are you looking for? Making the bridle joint is as much about angle cuts as about dimensions. It is not as difficult to make as a covered "V" joint and with a few simple jigs much of the initial work can be done on machines.
Author:  Steven Bollman [ Sun Oct 06, 2013 2:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
Clay S. wrote:
Hi Steven,
What dimensions are you looking for? Making the bridle joint is as much about angle cuts as about dimensions. It is not as difficult to make as a covered "V" joint and with a few simple jigs much of the initial work can be done on machines.


Thanks, Clay. The only machine I have at the moment is a router and a dremel. I'm trying to go as far as I can old school. with chisels, planes and saws.

Here's what I came up with. Took me a day.
Image

Image
Author:  Clay S. [ Sun Oct 06, 2013 10:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
Hi Steven,
It looks like you are on the right track. A few minor things - the peghead is cut 90 degrees at the joint, so the neck shaft usually has the angle cut on it. The "V" is usually cut to a wider angle so the hidden tenon comes closer to the sides of the neck shaft. Sometimes the hidden tenon is truncated (and maybe cut at an angle) so it doesn't continue into the tuner slots on slotted pegheads.
Your's looks like it will work fine though,and there is always more than one way to skin a cat.
Author:  Cal Maier [ Sun Oct 06, 2013 11:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
The article is in the American Lutherie Number 102/ Summer 2010.
By John Greven and Charles Freeborn.

Cal
Author:  nyazzip [ Mon Oct 07, 2013 12:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
here's a good look, on Facebook of all places
https://www.facebook.com/video/video.ph ... 5694812018
Author:  Tim Mullin [ Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
I presume you've already found this: http://www.grevenguitars.com/birds-beak-demo.html
Author:  Clay S. [ Mon Oct 07, 2013 5:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Does anyone have Bird's beak headstock joint dimensions?
Grevin's take on the modified bridle joint is a little different than how Martin did it. With Martin's method the volute is sawn to shape in the joint cutting process, and only refined by carving. The method of sawing leaves the hidden tenon to a bigger dimension than Grevin's method, and should give a better attachment to the peghead.
Frank Ford documented a peghead repair on an old Martin guitar and from the pictures you can see the difference I mentioned. You might also see how this joint can be cut using careful layout and good technique with a back saw.


http://frets.com/FretsPages/Luthier/Tec ... ore01.html
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/