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| Author: | mustache79 [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Crowning and polishing |
I've been slowly building my fretting tool collection. I have a variety of leveling beams and straightedges, now I'm focusing in on crowning and polishing tools. Does anyone have experience with this 3 in 1 crowing file from stew mac" http://www.stewmac.com/shopby/item/0679 ... MgodvD8ABA"? Also, I was looking for insight on fret polishing. Everyone seems to have different preferences. I could use some advice on what abrasives to work with. My thinking is 600, 800, grit sandpaper and a micro mesh pad of around 1200 grit. Suggestions would be appreciated. I did take a look at the fret dressing stick from stew mac, but the available replacement belts grits seemed to course for polishing. Thanks |
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| Author: | SteveSmith [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I used that Stewmac 3 in 1 fret file for a few years. It is ok but I finally upgraded to a diamond file -much nicer. I got this onehttp://www.stewmac.com/shop/Fretting_supplies/Shaping_and_crowning/Dual-grit_Diamond_Fret_File.html |
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| Author: | Barry Daniels [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 1:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I keep buffing simple. A good sanding with 320 grit wet or dry. Then to a buffing wheel with a gray bar compound. Full gloss in two steps. |
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| Author: | Stuart Gort [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 1:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I fret carrying the notion throughout that I'd like to take as little off the tops as possible when leveling...in order to...1. Avoid any serious crowning and 2. Improve and shorten the overall setup process. I tape of the board off like Filippo...but run a piece of tape along the fretboard edge prior to that. Note that the fretboard is already polished prior to fret installation. I use a thicker, nylon protective tape (more on that below) and then level with 600 grit. Using folded 1200 paper by hand, I then work out the 600 scratches in the direction of the frets. I keep adhesive backed 320 and 400 grit mounted to tongue depressors on hand if any more aggressive crowning needs to be done...but it rarely does. Then I use folded 600 and 1200 to dress the fret ends. I've also used a Dremel with Scotchbrite wheels to dress the ends with success...although one must be pretty careful not to chew through the tape. That nylon tape mentioned earlier protects MUCH better than masking tape when doing this...that's its only purpose. Leaving the tape on I take it to the StewMac polisher and, using the medium Menzurna compound for lacquer, bring the frets and the fret ends to a high luster. This contaminates both the wheel and the compound with metal residue so be prepared to keep your metal and lacquer wheels and compounds separate if you intend to try this. I recommend trying this though. It beats the tar out of polishing by hand. Lastly, I take all the tape off and do a final buff on the fretboard and frets together using minimal compound. Since the fretboard and frets are both already polished...this is basically a final cleaning up the face of the fretboard. It's really a bit of luck that the Menzurna medium compound takes nickle frets to a high luster after 1200 on the StewMac machine...but there you go. I'd rather be lucky than do research any day of the week. |
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| Author: | RustySP [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
The foam fingernail polishing sticks that the ladies use work pretty good in a pinch. Available everywhere. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 |
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| Author: | Michael.N. [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
Forget buying the 3 in 1, just buy one of the burrs and mount it on a wooden block. It actually works better than the supplied handle. Actually forget buying the burr, they are rubbish. Just buy a medium, flat smooth cut file. Thank me later. |
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| Author: | jfmckenna [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I use a triangular file to crown and a fret end file from Stew Mac to roll off the burrs on the tangs. Then follow with 320 - 400 - 600 - 0000 steel wool. I only tape up one fret at a time as I work and start from the highest fret and move back towards the nut. |
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| Author: | MikeyV [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
One of the things I love about building guitars (or anything I guess) is all the different ways that different people accomplish th esame task. My method is pretty close to the folks above: -bevel the ends with a large bastard file, hand held at about 45 degrees, or a bit more acute -Get the neck straight (with truss rod or 10 lbs of weight on the shoulders) -mark frets with black marker to show your progress..then... -level the frets (I use a very flat block of wood 320 grit PSA sand paper on it) -recrown with crowning file (use black marker on the fret tops to see your progress) -de-burr the fret ends with a triangular safe file -clean up with sand paper, up through the grits to 600 or 800 grit. -buff with a cloth, my finger and some polishing compund. So, beside sandpaper, all I use is a flat bastard file, a crowning file, and a triagular safe file. A hammer and nippers to install the frets. And a fret rocker to check for high ones. |
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| Author: | Tony_in_NYC [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I recently began using the "Fret Erasers" from Stew Mac. I like them alot, but they don't crown. For that, after I have leveled, I use a stick of wood, similar to the one Don Teeter shows in his book I believe, that has a slot filed into it to match the fret crown. I use 320 grit paper wrapped on the stick to recrown. The fret erasers are then used to polish. I also use a Dremel with Flitz polishing compound to bring out the shine when I have finished with the erasers. I only have the 600, 800 and 1000 grit erasers if memory serves. I didn't buy the full set. |
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| Author: | dzsmith [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I use the same sanding stick as Mr. Morelli and it works great for me. I reuse two pieces of tape on either side of the fret until it's worn out rather than cut thin pieces. Before leveling, I look for high frets with a straight edge and then a rocker. I level these off first so my beam does not teeter on a high fret. I do not mark the fret tops with a sharpie, rather I just buff it a bit with steel wool so I can see the flat areas. I still need to work out a technique for dressing the fret ends, right now I'm using a small file. BTW, Fender is advertising "hand-rolled fret board edges". Anyone know what this is? Update: OK, I cut the tape into pieces and covered the entire fret board. What a time-saver. I polished with Swirl remover using Dremel buffer wheel. Nice and shiny. Now I can see the flat areas on the frets I missed. I address that during setup. Thanks for the informative thread. |
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| Author: | dzsmith [ Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
Michael.N. wrote: Forget buying the 3 in 1, just buy one of the burrs and mount it on a wooden block. It actually works better than the supplied handle. Actually forget buying the burr, they are rubbish. Just buy a medium, flat smooth cut file. Thank me later. Yeah, the fret crowing file I bought should be renamed "fret scraping and gouging file". I almost threw the thing into my pond with all of the other messed up tools I bought. |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I would sand with 1500-4000grit micro mesh, then hit it with the same Menzerna wheel... not ideal but Menzerna works to polish the fret and it doesn't really affect the wheel for buffing finishes... I've also used it for polishing nuts too. I don't tape up the fingerboard, Micromesh won't do much to the fingerboard and the whole process polishes the fingerboard up a bit. I then clean it with naphtha to get all the black stuff off. For maple fingerboards I will tape it however... |
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| Author: | Jaybird840 [ Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I just purchased two "fret crowning" tools recently, and promply pitched them in the "sell" pile. User error? maybe... I just learned that I can crown more quickly and accurately with a safe-edged triangular file (a-la Stew Mac) than with these other crowning files. I use a 1"x2" solid aluminum bar that I trued on a granite slab for leveling and adhered sandpaper to. For polishing, I use the entire series of micromesh pads--maybe overkill, but it works well for me. Just my $0.02. |
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| Author: | Tony_in_NYC [ Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
Filippo Morelli wrote: Tony_in_NYC wrote: I recently began using the "Fret Erasers" from Stew Mac. I like them alot, but they don't crown. If you push hard enough ... Filippo Is that true Filippo? I have not tried them for crowning at all. I have just polished with them. Have you done it or are you speculating? It would save some time if it works. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Sat Aug 10, 2013 9:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I thought their intended purpose is polishing |
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| Author: | Tony_in_NYC [ Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
Look man, it's late, I'm tired, had a few beers... You understand. The fret erasers are abrasive so it'd not crazy to think that they would work. They do polish nicely. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 |
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| Author: | Jeffrey L. Suits [ Mon Aug 12, 2013 1:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I'm in the, "I no longer use crowning files", camp, too. I had treated myself to the nearly-hundred-dollar SM diamond files a couple of years ago, but didn't care for the schoolbus crowns. Stuart: tell me more about, " thicker, nylon protective tape". I've been using binding tape, rather than blue masking tape. |
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| Author: | Stuart Gort [ Mon Aug 12, 2013 2:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
Jeffrey L. Suits wrote: I'm in the, "I no longer use crowning files", camp, too. I had treated myself to the nearly-hundred-dollar SM diamond files a couple of years ago, but didn't care for the schoolbus crowns. Stuart: tell me more about, " thicker, nylon protective tape". I've been using binding tape, rather than blue masking tape. The product was 3M 8953 powder coating tape...which I have tons of left over from an old business. I say "was" because it appears to be discontinued by 3M. I said it was nylon but it could have been something like polyester silicone also. I would guess that most powdercoating tapes have similar properties though. The high temps would require a plastic that would, as a side benefit, probably be mar resistant and also a silicone adhesive that releases nicely. Mind you...that tape worked to resist the Scotchbrite Dremel wheel and that was the only reason I used that tape...and it didn't perfectly protect the fretboard either. If I went at it with a hamfisted approach I could chew through the tape. But with two layers of it (about .01" total) it would be hard to chew through before the fret end was nicely dressed. Aside from the prep work with the tape. There is no faster and better way to dress the fret ends than with the Scotchbrite wheels. I abandoned it because I use rolled up 600 and 1200 to "crown" the frets and remove leveling scratches anyway. After a few guitars I sort of came up with a way of rolling up the paper that allows me to also dress the fret ends with a few more short strokes after I hit the top of the fret. The tape prep is far simpler doing it by hand. |
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| Author: | murrmac [ Mon Aug 12, 2013 6:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
Jeffrey L. Suits wrote: I'm in the, "I no longer use crowning files", camp, too. I had treated myself to the nearly-hundred-dollar SM diamond files a couple of years ago, but didn't care for the schoolbus crowns. At last ...somebody else recognizes that the diamond crowning files ain't all they are cracked up to be ... |
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| Author: | Jeffrey L. Suits [ Tue Aug 13, 2013 1:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
murrmac wrote: Jeffrey L. Suits wrote: I'm in the, "I no longer use crowning files", camp, too. I had treated myself to the nearly-hundred-dollar SM diamond files a couple of years ago, but didn't care for the schoolbus crowns. At last ...somebody else recognizes that the diamond crowning files ain't all they are cracked up to be ... Oddly, I had a couple of older SM diamond files that I'd quite liked, that I gave away when I got the newer ones. |
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| Author: | Jeffrey L. Suits [ Sat Aug 02, 2014 9:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
Stuart Gort wrote: Jeffrey L. Suits wrote: I'm in the, "I no longer use crowning files", camp, too. I had treated myself to the nearly-hundred-dollar SM diamond files a couple of years ago, but didn't care for the schoolbus crowns. Stuart: tell me more about, " thicker, nylon protective tape". I've been using binding tape, rather than blue masking tape. The product was 3M 8953 powder coating tape...which I have tons of left over from an old business. I say "was" because it appears to be discontinued by 3M. I said it was nylon but it could have been something like polyester silicone also. I would guess that most powdercoating tapes have similar properties though. The high temps would require a plastic that would, as a side benefit, probably be mar resistant and also a silicone adhesive that releases nicely. Mind you...that tape worked to resist the Scotchbrite Dremel wheel and that was the only reason I used that tape...and it didn't perfectly protect the fretboard either. If I went at it with a hamfisted approach I could chew through the tape. But with two layers of it (about .01" total) it would be hard to chew through before the fret end was nicely dressed. Aside from the prep work with the tape. There is no faster and better way to dress the fret ends than with the Scotchbrite wheels. I abandoned it because I use rolled up 600 and 1200 to "crown" the frets and remove leveling scratches anyway. After a few guitars I sort of came up with a way of rolling up the paper that allows me to also dress the fret ends with a few more short strokes after I hit the top of the fret. The tape prep is far simpler doing it by hand. I've been using powder coating tape, since I read this--Thanks! |
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| Author: | Lonnie J Barber [ Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Crowning and polishing |
I use that exact same file. Then using the Stewmac fret erasers I go through all the grits. The last one leaves a perfect shine. I think Stewmac hit the nail on the head with this combo. It's just so simple to do a nice job. No expertise needed really. |
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