Official Luthiers Forum!

Hi all.

A customer brought me something odd the other day. It's definately an antique (Yogaslavian made by luthier Josip Rohrbacher in 1936). I'm not sure if it's a guitar (meaning that had 6 strings) that was converted to a mandolin later or if it was originally a mandolin (or mandola?). It's in pretty bad shape but the customer just want's to make it playable and than later maybe have it restored if it's worth it. I'd like to give him an idea of the value of what he has. Not a precise number, but just to let him know if it can carry some value or if it's a piece of junk. So if anyone has info on this, or about the luthier who made it, I'd appreciate it.

Thanks!

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Alain Moisan
Former full time builder of Acoustics, Classicals and Flamencos.
(Now building just for fun!)

Hey Alain,

Looks like some kind of wood topped banjo or possibly ukulele to me judging by the evidence of what appear to be the 4 original friction type tuner holes. I know I've got an old handmade wood topped 4 string banjo made in England. But there seems to be quite a bit of banjo/uke overlapping in that time period. No idea of value, just players interest in my opinion, could be lots of fun.

Joe

Thanks Joe.

Indeed, now that you have mentioned it, it really looks like it originally had 4 strings. Now having 4 strings, how would we call this? Does a 4 strings wooden topped banjo makes any sense?

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Alain Moisan
Former full time builder of Acoustics, Classicals and Flamencos.
(Now building just for fun!)

It looks to me as if it was originally a six string instrument. It is not in any way a banjo as in banjo like percussion. It appears that after the fact someone decided to octave coarse strings 1, 2, 5 and 6. This is where the two tuners at the top and the spare two tuner holes near the bottom came from. I do not believe they were original to the instrument because the could have been easily spaced properly if planed originally.

Thanks Michael. I got to say I'm pretty sure it originally har 4 strings. The 'spare holes' as you call them really look like they were there in the first place. Maybe the picture doesn't look good enough.

Also, I believe I have a name for this instrument: a Tambura. Here is a link: http://www.macedoniadirect.com/instruments/tambura.htm

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Alain Moisan
Former full time builder of Acoustics, Classicals and Flamencos.
(Now building just for fun!)

The existing six black knobbed tuners are evenly spaced. The lower sets of holes are not evenly spaced between the existing tuner posts. They are slightly closer to the first tuners than the second. The two tuners at the top are in the purfling work and scroll work of the peghead. This was not originally planed in my opinion. I could be wrong but I don’t think so.

Hmmm, not sure...

Here I highlighted in red what I believe to be the four original holes. They look pretty evenly spaced and centered to the headstock. It seems the 2 top bushings were violently extracted somehow...

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Alain Moisan
Former full time builder of Acoustics, Classicals and Flamencos.
(Now building just for fun!)

I have to agree with you Alain - this was originally a four-string instrument. The reason the group of black-buttoned machine heads looks equally spaced is that they're three-on-a-strip guitar machine heads. There are hundreds of local forms of stringed instruments across Europe - most countries have at least a couple of their own. I've had a quick look around but can't find anything else specifically like this. It might take a bit of digging, but I'm sure you'll be able to find information on it, maybe on folk music websites from countries that were part of the old Yugoslavia.

Good luck
Bri

Yep. I went back and looked close at the wear marks on the fretboard and frets. This was a 4 string instrument originally

Clever observation M.Payne!

Thanks!

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Alain Moisan
Former full time builder of Acoustics, Classicals and Flamencos.
(Now building just for fun!)

I copied his name into the Yahoo search box and got these links, among others. He seems to have been a builder of double basses or what's known as contrabasses. I'm not a luthier, but given the fact that he was a bass builder, I'd be willing to bet it was indeed originally a four string. What his work goes for now I haven't a clue.

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?tt=url&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jacobnorden.be%2Fdetail.cfm%3Flang%3Dfr%26cat%3D163%26id%3D921&lp=fr_en&.intl=us&fr=slv8-

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?tt=url&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jacobnorden.be%2Fcatalog.cfm%3Flang%3Dnl%26cat%3D163&lp=nl_en&.intl=us&fr=slv8-

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Mike

The only thing nescessary for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing.

Yea, I already went through those links before I posted here, but thanks anyway.

I know it's the same guy because it has the same label glued inside it.

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Alain Moisan
Former full time builder of Acoustics, Classicals and Flamencos.
(Now building just for fun!)

Cool. Good deal.

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Mike

The only thing nescessary for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing.

From what I could read, if it would be a bass tambura ( this luthier was a bass maker after all) it would have 3 courses of twin strings. Therefore 6 tuners.

http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Tambura
"There are several types of tambura, with three to four strings. The basic forms are samica (three double strings), bisernica (two double strings and two single strings; four tones), prim (one double string and three single strings; four tones), bas-prim or brač (two double strings and two single strings; four tones), čelović (two double strings and two single strings; four tones), čelo (four strings), bas or berda (four strings), and bugarija or kontra (two double strings and one single string; three tones). The names of the instruments and method of playing them depends on the tuning of the strings."

Thanks Alain.

He was not only a bass maker. On the label, the list of instrument types is listed and although I cannot understand all that is written, the words 'tambura' and 'gitara' are clearly indicated, amongst others.

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Alain Moisan
Former full time builder of Acoustics, Classicals and Flamencos.
(Now building just for fun!)

Hi Alain,
What a great looking instrument. I believe what you have there is a Banjo-Uke sometimes called a "Banjolele" although I believe "Banjolele" is a patented brand.

Banjo ukes were popular in the 30's. Probably the best known player was the Englishman George Formby. http://www.ukuleleman.co.uk/. Lots of companies produced them including Gibso, Bacon, and Epiphone.

Hope this helps,
Lefty