Official Luthiers Forum!

Hi OLFer's!

For your viewing pleasure, I have just published a profile on Indian Rosewood as part of my ongoing tonewood database. As always, improvements, corrections and additional information/ your own experiences are much appreciated- I'll update the profile citing you and linking back to you! This may be a little contentious, so do send in your comments!

I can't link pics directly to here so do pop by to http://guitarbench.com/index.php/2008/10/15/indian-rosewood-tonewood-database/
for the full Visual presentation. As always, I present the text portion of the interview for your consideration- although I do highly recommend popping by to see the pics!

Warmest regards,
Terence
http://www.guitarbench.com

Dalbergia Latifolia| Tonewood Profile | "Indian Rosewood"

Tonewoods Database

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Indian rosewood consists of 2 species: Dalbergia Sisso and Dalbergia Latifolia. Both are similar in appearance and physical properties although their natural history differs.

Quick Facts
Scientific name: Dalbergia Sisso/ Latifolia
Trade names: Indian Rosewood
Janka: 3100lbf
Uses: Back & sides, drop tops, veneer
RIYL: Rosewoods
Bling factor: Tends to be Homogenous
Availability: Steady
CITES status: Not listed. No restrictions

Natural History

Dalbergia Sissoo is a semi-evergreen deciduous tree. It is found in the lowlands, along river banks in it's native range which extends from Nepal through India and into Pakistan.

It is a hardy tree and has been cultivated extensively in major cities in India where air quality, drainage and soil quality are poor. Sissoo attains heights of 30 m in height and trunk diameters of 80 cm. Compared to Latifolia, the saplings of D.sissoo are shade intolerant.

Dalbergia Latifolia is a semi-evergreen deciduous tree. It is found in the lowlands, along river banks in it's native range which extends from Indonesian Java to the sub-Himalayas through India and into Pakistan. It is not aa hardy as Sisso requiring good drainage and water- tree stunting is common in some sites due to lack of these factors. Latifolia is a larger tree than Sisso and attains heights of 40 m in height and trunk diameters of 2 m. Compared to Sissoo, the saplings of D.latifolia are shade tolerant.

Status

Dalbergia Sissoo is widely planted as a cash crop, shade tree and ornamental in the Indian sub-continent. Large plantations on Java provide a steady source of timber where it is called Sonokeling.

Although more demanding than Sissoo, Dalbergia Latifolia has been successfully introduced to Burma, Sri Lanka, Nepal, Nigeria, and Kenya. On Java, it is considered to be almost the same as Sissoo and is also referred to as Sonokeling.

Physical properties

The heartwood of Dalbergia Sissoo is dark brown with a white sapwood. It is a hard, durable wood which displays good stability and ease of bending. It has a Janka rating of 3100 and a specific gravity of 0.7-0.8.

Dalbergia Latifolia has a heartwood that is purple-brown with a dark streaks. It is a hard, durable wood which displays good stability and ease of bending.

As a tonewood...

As a tonewood, Indian Rosewood has been an industry standard for the past few decades. It's acceptance over Brazilian rosewood stems from it's wider availability and sustainability.

Subjective tone...

I would classify this wood as providing a dark and woody overtone content with a low end predominance.

Availability

Widely available due to plantation stock.


Tonewoods Database

References:
Wikipedia
ISSG database
PIER database
US forestry service database

©2008 Terence Tan.

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Any infringement of copyright is entirely unintentional. Any copyright issues should be address to: writers@guitarbench.com. We will attempt to resolve these issues quickly. We accept that we can make mistakes and omissions thus, any additions or corrects will be cheerfully accepted!

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you should point out that plantation indian rosewood (dalbergia latfolia) is known in the trade as sonokeling rosewood and is not considered as suitable for guitars becouse of its wide grain and color variation.
its generaly much more an inferior wood than the old growth stock and varies in quality much more than the old growth stock.
that said there are some company,s that offer sonokeling for guitar at a greatly reduced price.
i noticed one large manufacturer offering it as Aisan rosewood for there guitars recently.

dalbergia sissoo is also known as shesham and rarely makes it to the guitar market as its courser grained and lighter in color.
shesham is the stuff you find carvings and those little indian boxes are made from.

The reason that old growth dalbergia latfolia is still available for the guitar trade is becouse the indian govenment have put very strict controls on logging and trade for old growth indian rosewood.
the forests are managed by the government who fell the trees to a small quoter each year.
these logs are then sold to the mills within india at auctions.
this is why you can not buy old growth indian rosewood lumber but sonokeling lumber is readily available.
india banned all exports of forest grown dalbergia latfolia unless its been processed for parts.
this not only means that they have a vested interest in managing the forests but it generates jobs for for the local mills buy the logs from government auctions, whilst garunteing that we have ready supply of quality cheap indian rosewood for the forseable future.

the reason that the plantation stock was labeled as sonokeling was becouse they needed to diferentiate clearly between plantation and old growth wood.

this is the reason why all indian rosewood is cut in india.
and why indian rosewood is cut very thick and not to the standards of western guitar wood manufacturers.
sometimes you get sonokeling cut into guitar parts in other country,s but this is usualy sold much cheaper than the premium old growth stock.

There are some dealers who sell plantation stock at old growth prices but in general the good availablility of premium old growth indian rosewood is due to good forest management and trading restrictions put in place by the indian govenment.

i wish brazil had done something simalar with rio rosewood we may still be using today with a clear consionce if this was the case.

if you like i could include some photo,s that show the diference between sonokeling and old growth indian rosewood.

I hope this info helps,

Joel.

Joel,

Thanks for the info and the offer. Some photos would be very helpful.

Pat

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formerly known around here as burbank
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http://www.patfosterguitars.com

Thanks for the info Joel, but Sonokeling was originally used to refer to the plantation stock from Indonesia and not from other countries- India & Burma has plantation stock too, did not sell under the name Sonokeling. Also, Sonokeling refers to both Sissoo and Latifolia, of with Sissoo is slightly more common. These days it's all lumped together or even worse, Sonokeling is treated like a different species.

I have lived in Jakarta for a time and went to tour the plantations and there are 1 or 2 stands of trees which have produced lumber I consider to be good enough for backs and sides. But you are right about the majority of the wood, although they make excellent binding and fretboard stock. I think the large stands tend to be Sissoo and the smaller ones Latifolia- Sissoo's easier and faster to grow. Problem is that the timber all looks about the same- uniform light brown, with only 1 plantation producing very dark, streaky lumber. I bought some cants of the really nice stuff, but it's all gone now without me photographing it.

Forests in India are government managed but private land owners do sell off their trees too. Shade trees are generally considered useless for backs and sides and used for furniture/ carving stock.

BTW, I've been to the Burmese plantations and they are big- but not a monoculture. I spoke to the guys who said the original stands were primary forest which the generals chopped for teak and Dalberigias and Ebonies. I went to the gemstone auction but got sidetracked... oh yes, there was a supply of Latifolia from Burma some years ago... I wonder where they got it from... Manipur? I was given some and it's really nice old growth Indian. Definitely Latifolia.

Terence
www.guitarbench.com

My Sonokeling from Indonesia is better than my estate EIR from LMII or Allied Lutherie, and the denser/darker ones are quite good. Even the lighter Sonokeling has richer color and smaller pores than the ugly grayish estate wood. Does klin process make the color dull?

IMHO, good-sounding guitars can still be made from the estate woods, although the taptones are usually duller.

Thanks for the pictures... I was just wondering what the heck sonokling is and if it's inferior since I am about to buy a set of tops, backs (sonokling), and neck blanks (african mahogany) from the supplier you mentioned. At their prices it makes building guitars in a time of recession and crappy exchange rates a reality. Have you actually bought tops from that supplier? at his price it's a real steal but I just hope it doesn't turn out to be a lemon.

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Cat-gut strings are made from kitten guts, stretched out to near breaking point and then hardened with grue saliva. As a result these give a feeling of Pain and anguish whenever played, and often end up playing themselves backwards as part of satanic rituals.

Typhoon Guitars
http://www.typhoon-guitars.com

tai fu,

sonokeling can make some very nice sounding and looking instruments its a nice wood in its own right.
what i dont like is it being sold at high prices as old growth wood.

sonokeling should be cheap but it can represent very good value for money and you can make some awsome guitars from it,

Joel.