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how deep/thick/tall/high are the PRS SE 2018 frets?

this is to help me calculate the minimum depth of the graphtech nut slots; i.e. fret height + minimum space between fret and string = total distancing for nut slots.

many thanks!

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drugstoredir2014.com

That's not how it's done. You and only you can measure the height of your own frets. Every guitar is different.

But the height of your nut slots are determined by feel with strings on the guitar. Press down the string between the 2nd and 3rd frets, then set the nut slot so that the string just clears the first fret.

Yup, that's the way. I used to measure the gap between the first fret and the bottom of the string with feeler guages and bring the nut slot down to a specific height, but I've found doing it Barry's way is way faster, simpler, and deals with the unique quirks of a particular guitar better. Although setting the action at the nut is still not a "fast" job for me it was just painful before.

Along with holding the string down at the 3rd fret as Barry suggests, I'll also tap the string at the first fret ever so gently with my finger while I'm holding the string down at the third fret. If it's right you should hear a little "ting" sound as the string makes contact with the fret. If you hear nothing your nut slot is either still too high or its now too low.

A word of caution, I always find the graphtech slots cut way faster than bone. Go slow and check often. Going too low on your slots is a PAIN!

I do four things.

Get the frets prefectly leveled and dressed, set the relief.

Draw a line with a half pencil laying on the first two frets on the face of the nut. That is a "zero fret" line and I want to approach it but not go beyond it.

As I file the slots I measure the gap between the bottom of the string and the top of the first fret with a feeler gauge. I have learned over the years gaps that work for me (and a lot of others apparently), I slowly lower the slot until the tight string approaches that gap. Fwiw, starting with the first string, these will work pretty well but you might prefer something else - 0.014, 0.014, 0.015, 0.016, 0.017, 0.018. You will find those are less than most factory settings.

As a final check I will do Barry's test - hold the string down at the third fret (it will also be touching the second) and check the gap at the first fret. I want some gap, as little as possible but still measureable or at least pingable.

Edit to add, all of my measurements are in decimal inches.

Based on ALL the advice in this thread, I decided to follow this example: for electric guitar: https://www.guitaranswerguy.com/guitar-action-good-string-height/
Low E: 0.3mm (0.012”)
High E: 0.15mm (0.006”)

so,

low E .30mm
A .27mm
D .24mm
G .21mm
B .18mm
high E .15mm

...done with: eye/ear/fingers and feeler gauge (won't be perfect!) LOL!

Not brave enough to do: "0.014, 0.014, 0.015, 0.016, 0.017, 0.018" - lol.

Anyway, I have a bit of fret buzz now! The 'relief' is OK (I.M.H.O). Can i Simply raise the individual saddles until the buzz is eliminated ?

The PRS specs. are:

Bass side E string height 1st fret: .60mm
Treble side E string height 1st fret: .40mm

Many Thanks!

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drugstoredir2014.com

Yes.

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"Act your age, not your shoe size" - Prince

These specs are WAY too high and as it's been said this is not how it's done. Nut slots are not cut off the guitar and expected to be well cut.

To give you an example of a well cut nut slot and how far off your source is we will cut high e's measured in distance off the top of the first fret at around .0005". As the strings get more massive the gap increases but each string is individually addressed with the method that Barry indicated and I'll add tuned to pitch with the stings on the instrument and lifted to cut, put back to measure, repeat.

Be aware that it's possible and even common for a well cut nut slot to be lower.... yep lower than the first fret. Strings leaving the nut slots ark into space a bit and that's why they can be lower than the 1st fret at times depending on the stiffness of the string and still have space over the first fret.

Guitar set-up is sequential and not just going back and forth adjusting this side and then compensating for what went wrong on that side.

My process and I'm not going to go into any detail but here is the sequence that I use:

1) Adjust the truss rod for nearly no relief on the treble side and more relief on the bass side IF... if the neck will do it. Compromises often have to be made because f*ctories and some builders don't dress their fret planes to have minimal relief on the treble side and more on the bass side.

2). With the thing tuned to pitch and the rod adjusted each nut slot is individually addressed with a gauged nut file that when properly used will result in a slot that can handle one size up in strings with no binding. Slots are cut very low but never to the point of the sitar sound. The lower the nut slots are cut the far fewer intonation issues that most people complain about. Additionally low slots are an absolute joy to play and our clients just melt over them to the point that it's embarrassing at times how grateful they are that they can for the first time in their lives make that F barre chord.

3). After 1 and 2 the action is set measured at the 12th, set at the saddles only, leave the rod alone and that's why we do this sequentially you should not have to back track at any point and readdress what you have already addressed. Action specs, I use my specs.... are variable for instrument type, string gauges, player attack, sort of heavy metal vomit music or not played, condition of the fret plane and if any dang drop tunings are going to be in play. A typical Strat set-up for me is 4/64th" high e at the 12th and 4.5/64th" for the low e at the 12th. A finger style acoustic OM might be 4/64th" and 5.5/64th" and so on and so forth.

4). With rod set, nut slots cut, action set at the 12th I bang out nearly every note on the thing with a heavy attack to see if it objects to what I'm telling it to do. I'm looking for buzzing and then I do full step bends up the neck looking for fretting out. If it passes this test the action is not too low for the condition of this fret plane.

5). Intonation is set with the saddles with the guitar in the playing position and tuned to pitch. On an acoustic without any way to adjust the action beyond a new saddle or a relocated saddle it's simply checked to see if it's problematic. On an electric I set the intonation as precisely as I can using the individual saddles.

6). Then I play Purple Haze (electric) and Purple Rain (acoustic) and if it does well and my playing irritates my business partner I put it in the case, fill out the bill, call the client, next.

A day in the Life of Hesh Dennisovich so-to-speak.

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Ann Arbor Guitars

I have a number of issues with that guitar answer guy's methods. Don't always believe what you read on the internet. Oh wait, this is on the internet, so you can't believe what I just said.

Hi,

my string action at 12th. fret (open):

E 1.50mm (high)
A 1.65mm
D 1.75mm
G 1.90mm
B 1.95mm
E 2.00mm

my neck relief is approx. 0.12mm (@ frets: 1/7/16).

my Nut slot heights: (@ 1st. fret)

low E .30mm
A .27mm
D .24mm
G .21mm
B .18mm
high E .15mm

can anyone confirm that this is an acceptable setup please?

cheers!

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drugstoredir2014.com

Oh poop!

I've just sat down for a quick practice and I've got a buzz on the 'G' string at the first fret!
After I cut the nut slots (AFTER), I decided to to tighten the truss rod to decrease the relief to 0.12mm (from 0.25mm) which required me to lift the saddles quite a bit! All seemed fine on the bench, but then 'playing' = BUZZ on 'G' @ 1st. fret.

Can I fix this somehow? "URGENT!"

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drugstoredir2014.com

The relief is fine, the 12th fret action is fine, the first fret action is probably too low, but if you have the "back fret clearance" that Barry talks about that is the final check (fret each string at 3 which also frets it at 2, you should have a hair of clearance at 1 - I measure it by tapping the string over the 1st fret and listening for a little ping)

I would call this medium low action, probably what a shredder would like. It would be marginal for me.



If you will reread my rant, er, previous posts and link, set the relief first and leave it. One of the things you need to understand about doing a setup is which parameters affect others - adjusting the relief will change both 12th and to a minor extent, 1st fret action. Get the frets perfect, the get the relief where you want it and don't touch it.

You mention a buzz on the G string at the first fret, do you mean the open G string is buzzing against the first fret, or do you mean when you play the first fret on the G string your getting a buzz?

If its buzzing while open then your slot is too low, and its time to build a new nut, or in a pinch you can squeak by with making a paste of super glue and bone dust to fill the slot and re-cut it.

If its a buzz when the string is fretted at the first fret it's likely a low spot on that fret. If the fretwork isn't great, or there is a lot of fret wear, all of your meticulous set up work to achieve that low action will result in random buzzy spots and frustration. It can be hard to know how much your set up will be limited by the condition of the frets without some experience.

The frets are near perfect level and dressed correctly.
The buzz on the 'G' string is happening when played 'open' (no hand fretting).
I realise I should have set the relief BEFORE cutting the nut slots, but it was a last minute impulsive decision to 'pull it back a bit', but it's backfired somewhat!
The truss was adjusted by roughly a quarter turn.
I suppose I could fill the slot with something and re-cut it, given it's a black graphtech (TUSQ) that is impregnated with lubricant.
Also, reverse the relief in tiny amounts until the buzz is gone? Then lower the saddles a bit to compensate?
Cheers to all helpers. many thanks!

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drugstoredir2014.com

Shim the nut.

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"Act your age, not your shoe size" - Prince

Don't set the neck relief as a function of an incorrectly cut nut.

Set neck relief and cut the nut slots properly. If you went too far fill the slot or make a new nut and start over. Shimming a nut is a possibility too but on new guitars and high end guitars there is no substitute for a properly cut nut.

Filling is a long walk on a short pier for most here. The old CA and bone or nut material dust doesn't last very long and is not suitable for high-value commercial work in our view. We've invested in and have and use Dentist equipment with the activation light and light cured dental fillings in all shades so we can even match who J. Gilles described as Goober Goober with the Green Teeth (that's a song reference).

Light cured dental fillings are harder than the bone itself and last longer. But few have the technology to provide that so maybe try dust and CA and raise the slot and recut.

A string that buzzes open and the buzz goes away when fretted is almost always the nut slot is too low. This is another reason why nut slots should not be cut off the instrument nor should the half pencil line be used as a reference for slot depth but for removing excess top height only instead. Again I can cut a nut slot below the half pencil line and have it not be too low so that line is meaningless in the context of variable string gauges, stiffness and tension as they strings ark over and out of the nut slot face. More reason when nut slots are cut in real time on the guitar with strings on tuned to pitch and relief set.

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Ann Arbor Guitars

Considerable! (as an option)

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drugstoredir2014.com

The nut slots were cut in real time on the guitar with strings on & tuned to pitch and relief set first (before cutting) and it worked! I was meticulous with the feeler gauges on each slot and string! The amount that the 'G' string catches the fret IS minute; something I do not have the electronic/microscopic measuring tools to calculate, i.e. only by hand and ear! It must be something like 50,000 thousandth to 100,000 thousandth, we are talking like: a 10th. of a hairs width! My particular 'G' does vibrate a hell of a lot more than the other stings at the 1st. fret! The slots was cut with the next size up in file width for string gauge 9/42.

The 'extra' relief was an after thought and impulsive when I saw the .12mm thing. Previously I was on .25mm. No buzz! (which is PRS's 'SE' recommended upper limit).

So, I was thinking of backing off the relief, one degree at a time until the buzz stops.

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drugstoredir2014.com

This conversation reminds me why I like to build with a zero fret.

I backed off the truss by a quarter turn to see what would happen then! (i.e. relief as 'factory')

I now have:

'G' string at 1st. fret .24mm
relief is approx. .30mm @ 7th. fret (1 & 16 held)
'E' (low) @ 12th. fret 2.00mm

the 'G' string still buzzes! (played open)

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drugstoredir2014.com

What should it be please?

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drugstoredir2014.com

Those are my targets unless I know something about the player or the guitar that makes me want to use something different. Other techs will use other numbers.

As it is now I got:

1st fret gap
.16mm 'E'
.20
.24 buzzing when open
.26
.33
.33

12th. fret gap
1.50mm 'E'
1.80
1.82
1.84
1.96
2.00

relief @ 7th. fret .30mm (held @ 1 & 16)
Saddles: 'very high'

Ping test: 3rd./1st. frets:

gap:

.06mm E
.10mm B
.12mm G
.12mm D
.13mm A
.13mm E (low)

what is your prognosis please?
presume your measurements are mm?

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drugstoredir2014.com

So, what is the correct set up procedure please?
I HAVE SENT FOR A NEW NUT!

1. Set the PRS floating tremolo bridge plate to 1/16th".
2. set the individual saddles to what?
3. set relief to 0.12mm @ 7th. fret?
4. cut nut slots as previously stated
5. keep in tune
6. set intonation

thanks in advance!

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drugstoredir2014.com

This is a very frustrating thread.

Question for the OP...… What kind of doctor are you?

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"Act your age, not your shoe size" - Prince