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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 10:04 pm 
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Looking good, Mr. Fenske!


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:41 am 
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Too bad about the cracks... looks like you've got things nicely bent though. Glue 'em and move on.

There's really not much trickery to cutaway mitering... just do it. Mark a line a bit away from where the actual edge will be so you'll have it as a reference for square while you finetune things. Saw it close, drag along sandpaper until the miter angle looks about right, repeat for the other side, check the fit, sand more if necessary, and glue it. Try to get the angles right while the pieces are still a touch too long, for safety, and then sand some more, maintaining the angle as closely as possible.

That back inlay is awesome, especially considering your lack of tools.

Also, as nice as those tuners look, I think I'd actually save them and go with the cheapo ebay ones for this, since they looked a bit lighter weight :) I'd also do a Spanish cedar neck, with 1/2" (~12.7mm) carbon fiber bar, rather than the adjustable truss rod... those things are heavy, and on a short neck like this, the comfortable thickness is proportionally much stiffer compared to a full size guitar neck. Plus the shorter scale means you can do lower string tension. But it's probably a bit late to change now since you've already got the neck roughed out, and adjustable rod acquired. And I'm just really obsessive about weight and balance :geek:

Totally cool build. But the name piccolo guitar makes me think full octave above normal... I think I'll have to build that sometime. A literal 1/2 size guitar :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:29 am 
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[/quote] I'd also do a Spanish cedar neck, with 1/2" (~12.7mm) carbon fiber bar, rather than the adjustable truss rod... those things are heavy, and on a short neck like this, the comfortable thickness is proportionally much stiffer compared to a full size guitar neck. Plus the shorter scale means you can do lower string tension. [/quote]

What sort of depth of bar would you use? Would you use two bars? Final question, would you use larger carbon fibre bar for a bigger guitar?

Thanks

Ed


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:46 pm 
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Hastings Guitars wrote:
Quote:
I'd also do a Spanish cedar neck, with 1/2" (~12.7mm) carbon fiber bar, rather than the adjustable truss rod... those things are heavy, and on a short neck like this, the comfortable thickness is proportionally much stiffer compared to a full size guitar neck. Plus the shorter scale means you can do lower string tension.

What sort of depth of bar would you use? Would you use two bars? Final question, would you use larger carbon fibre bar for a bigger guitar?

1/2" is the depth. 1/8" width, as that's what's commonly available. Probably just one bar down the center for this, but two wouldn't hurt.

For a full size steel string guitar with Spanish cedar neck, I'd use two of those bars, plus an adjustable truss rod. Or one of these http://www.dragonplate.com/ecart/categories.asp?cID=130.

I almost went with two CF bars alone on my harp guitar's butternut neck (similar so Spanish cedar), but chickened out. It probably would have been fine for at least 10-20 years, but I shoot for 100. Adjustable rods have a pretty good track record in the years they've been around, and are a lot cheaper, and easier to install than the D tube. The D tube is much lighter weight, though.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:19 pm 
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Wow, it's been a while since I updated this thread. I have done quite a bit on it, but I just haven't got around to uploading the pictures yet. oops_sign The rims are almost complete and I've started carving the neck. I've also been making some carbon flying braces to stiffen up the neck area. I got the idea after looking at Mike Doolin's double cutaway design. I'll post pictures soon...

DennisK wrote:
That back inlay is awesome, especially considering your lack of tools.


Thank you - that means a lot coming from you! Your inlays are incredible.

DennisK wrote:
Also, as nice as those tuners look, I think I'd actually save them and go with the cheapo ebay ones for this, since they looked a bit lighter weight :) I'd also do a Spanish cedar neck, with 1/2" (~12.7mm) carbon fiber bar, rather than the adjustable truss rod... those things are heavy, and on a short neck like this, the comfortable thickness is proportionally much stiffer compared to a full size guitar neck. Plus the shorter scale means you can do lower string tension. But it's probably a bit late to change now since you've already got the neck roughed out, and adjustable rod acquired. And I'm just really obsessive about weight and balance :geek:
:


I'm not too worried about balance at the moment. I've never played a guitar that wasn't neck heavy, so I don't know what I'm missing :mrgreen: . And with such a big headstock relative to the neck size, I think it would be hard to do with any tuners.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 12:57 pm 
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Well here they are.
Gluing in the neck block
Image

Corner block
Image

Tail block
Image

All the sides joined together
Image

On this guitar, I'm trying out another idea from Matsuda's guitars - the cutaway soundport. The sides are still too wide at this point, but you can see the general idea.
Image

More to come...

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:03 pm 
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I've been working on the neck as well. Here is the tenon:
Image

Fitted into the neck block
Image

Headstock being glued on.
Image

And fitted to the rims.
Image

Some size comparison shots:
Image

Image

Using my ultra-complicated kerfing jig:
Image

Linings being glued on
Image

More to come...

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:10 pm 
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Now for the carbon fibre braces. I laminated a strip of douglas fir, with 2 layers of woven and one layer of unidirectional per side. I then vacuum bagged the whole lot, with peel ply both sides to give a good surface texture. I'm thinking of polishing them too, but I don't know if it's worth it as you can hardly see them through the soundhole, but it would look cool :P .

Image

Image

Image

I haven't quite finished shaping them yet. They need to be arched a lot more.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:59 pm 
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Looking good Pete! I'm interested in your cutaway sound port. Can't say I've seen that before.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:20 pm 
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Thanks! Here's the original by Michi Matsuda:
I hope mine turns out that good!
Image

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:59 pm 
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On this guitar, I'm trying out another idea from Matsuda's guitars - the cutaway soundport. The sides are still too wide at this point, but you can see the general idea.

Neat! That'll look awesome!

Alex

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:32 pm 
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Thanks!
I've roughly carved the neck. On my first guitar, the neck was way too chunky, so I hope this one will be more comfortable. It's a bit awkward carving such a short neck - there's hardly enough room to get the tools in there!
Image

Image

The heel is shaped to blend into the cutaway.
Image

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 7:21 pm 
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Yeah, cool soundport. Not sure if I like the small return in the original, I think I'd hve it dive into the interior of the guitar, and simply re-inforce the back at that area, but I'd have to play with it a bit to get what works for me, as do we all.... duh


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:34 pm 
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Ah, I see where you're going with this thick sides thing... :lol: :D

Luv the modern art rosette, and the avant garde soundhole! That should get some "enveloping sound" to the player.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:32 pm 
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PeterF wrote:
This is going to be a total experiment for me as I can't find any information about it at all! So I'm going to make it up :lol: . It will be a small bodied, 6 string guitar. I don't even know for sure what it is called!

Body length: 380mm / 15in
Lower bout: 285mm / 11in
Scale length: 484mm / 19in

I'm trying to make it all out of wood that I already have, so the soundboard will be parana pine, neck, back and sides will be some more of that mahogany shelving of which I have stacks and the back, fingerboard and binding will be jatoba (I think). I'll probably use a carbon fibre insert instead of a truss rod, as I don't know where you could get one that short.


Mine: Body length: 406.400mm / 16"
Lower bout: 285.750mm / 11-1/4"
Upper bout: 209.550mm / 8-1/4"
Scale length: 543mm / 21.375"
Plan from LMI 3/4 size Acoustic guitar, similar to Martinstyle 5


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:24 pm 
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Greg B wrote:
Ah, I see where you're going with this thick sides thing... :lol: :D

Luv the modern art rosette, and the avant garde soundhole! That should get some "enveloping sound" to the player.

Thanks! That's what I'm hoping. I'm trying to get a big, full sound out of this little guitar

nickinbruns wrote:
Yeah, cool soundport. Not sure if I like the small return in the original, I think I'd hve it dive into the interior of the guitar, and simply re-inforce the back at that area, but I'd have to play with it a bit to get what works for me, as do we all.... duh

I've been thinking about that return part but I can't think of another way of doing it. You would have to stop the binding at the hole and that would look odd. Unless you put in a small, triangular section reinforcement patch the height of the binding, which might work.

herry tze wrote:
Mine: Body length: 406.400mm / 16"
Lower bout: 285.750mm / 11-1/4"
Upper bout: 209.550mm / 8-1/4"
Scale length: 543mm / 21.375"
Plan from LMI 3/4 size Acoustic guitar, similar to Martinstyle 5

It looks like yours is just a few inches bigger than mine. It'll be interesting to compare the sound once they're done.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:38 pm 
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So there's a bit more progress to report. All the linings are on and I've got the top and back to a thickness that feels right. I managed to get the circle cutter working, so I cut out the soundhole.
Image

And glued on the back centre strip.
Image

I glued a cross-grain maple veneer over the end of the soundport to stop cracks. That was a nightmare to clamp in place!
Image

The carbon flying braces have also been shaped and glued in with thickened epoxy. I decided to remove the lower half at the neck end because the rotational movement of the neck would have put tension on the bottom and compression on the top and I didn't know how the glue joint would react. Hopefully having it all in compression will reduce the stress.
Image

It also gives more air space to the soundport.
Image

Finally, I've also laid out the fretboard ready for slotting. That's something I'm really not looking forward to! :?
Image

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:52 pm 
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Braces roughed out and laid in place. The X brace is 6mm thick, UTB 9mm and all other braces about 3-4mm thick. Back braces are 5/6mm. Does this sound too thick? Opinions would be appreciated. [:Y:]
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:41 pm 
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Looking good, Peter. Are you going to scallop?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 7:38 am 
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Well, I have been away for a couple of weeks, so nothing new building-wise, but I have discovered that a guitar of the same dimensions has been built before! This is a guitar by Nehemiah Covey and he called it a quinto (meaning 'fifth'). I think that is a better name than piccolo (which just means 'small' in Italian). http://www.billpillmore.com/CoveyQuinto.html

Casey, I will probably scallop the finger and fan braces and taper the X brace. That's what I did on my last guitar and it seemed to work pretty well. I hope to get the box closed next weekend.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 8:25 am 
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Interesting. When I here quinto I think of the Mexican guitar "bajo quinto". A 10 sting guitar. They look pretty dang cool too.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 10:21 pm 
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The Requinto is tuned up to A-D-G-C-E-A, (the "Bajo Requinto" is a Bass 10 stringed thing). The Requinto is for the soloist and is a traditional instrument here in Mexico (where I am), I hear requinto playing all the time, it's a normal soloist guitar. Never liked romantic music much, but have run across it enough times to know that there is the "Requinto Romantico" which is the 6 string, and the "Requinto Jarocho" which is a 4 stringer.
Here is a Youtuber http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWQKSKZ5oiY

Never seen a requinto with a side-port so believe me there would be a lot of dudes interested in your requinto in MX.

I'll try and find a requinto built by a good luthier and post it here.
-R

EDIT; Couldn't find a Requinto built by a famous luthier, or even one with a cut-away (they usually have one!), but there is this one http://jmdayas.blogspot.mx/


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:01 am 
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I thought requinto's were tuned up a third, like a terz guitar? Also, this is a steel string, so I guess it will sound rather different to a classical requinto.

Edit: How could I be so blind? I didn't even see the connection between 'requinto' and 'quinto'! laughing6-hehe

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Last edited by PeterF on Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:08 am 
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Peter you should put one of them really cool ornate bridges on this guitar. Like the bajo quinto and bajo sexto have. It would be a lot of work but boy they look sweet.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:30 am 
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Wow, that looks like fun! I'll have to think out a design that would go with the rest of the instrument and see what it looks like.

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