Official Luthiers Forum!

I'm debating about whether or not to fret my fingerboard before attaching it to the neck. It looks like most of you do this afterwards, but some of you do this before.

Could any of you please help me out by listing some pros and cons of each?

The only reason that I'm thinking of doing this before hand is because I'm nervous that I might have trouble with the frets that are above the body. The only fret tool that I have is the fret hammer (and the clippers and nippers). Maybe I could just fret those frets before attaching the fingerboard and do all of the others afterwards?

Any information to help me make up my mind would be greatly appreciated.blain197639111.7105092593

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Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."

I attach FB to neck first. If you have the Cumpiano book, dig through there and find the tenon caul. Attach that under the extension and hammer away. (though, I press mine)

Ron

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OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

I used to fret before attaching to the neck. I switched away from that because I found it wasn't level after gluing on. Since then, there have been a few discussions about water based glues (I was using titebond) causing swelling and making the neck/fingerboard untrue after gluing. The solution many are using is gluing the fingerboard with epoxy which will not cause the swelling. So if you decide to fret first, take that into account.

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David White, Toronto

"All my favourite singers can't sing."

I glue the fingerboard on and fit the neck to the body and make sure everything is all level and good. Then I remove the neck and install the frets "off the body". This is one of the advantages I've found to using a Mayes style bolt-on neck.

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Dave Rector
Rector Guitars

I have tried Fretting after glueing fret board to the neck but had some problems with to much Back bow. I have returned to fretting before glueing to the neck and have never had a problem with this method. Rarely do I have to even do any leveling after glueing the Fretboard on. I know others have had very different experiences but this is what works for me.

if you are sufficiently confident that you can build with a perfect neckangle/top radius/ bridge height then it is not a bad thing to fret before.

if you are not 100% confident in your ability to be perfectly accurate in regard to those aspects then you are better off fretting after the neck is on. the reason: you can flatten any 12th/14th fret hump.

as i came to building out of repair work, fretting with the neck on was what i had to learn, and never found good reason to change. backbow because of your frets should not happen if you use the correctly sized saw/wire combination. as for fretting over the body a small sandbag or shot bag will provide adequate support unless you are a ham handed oaf who thinks muscle is the cure for all problems. installing frets is a tapping operation, not a "hammering" one. finesse works, muscle doesn't. crazymanmichael39111.8539583333

Don't forget Tim McNight's Fretting Technique. I tried fretting before and I'm just not accurate enough to get it all perfect so I'll fret afterward. There is no single more important feature of a guitar IMO than the neck if you fret after you can adjust a lot of things before those frets become playable or very playable.

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Thank You and Best To All

The following consists of the blatherings of a relative novice:

Most of my fretting experience has consisted of doing refrets on beaters that may or may not have needed a refret. These (a half dozen or so) were obviously done on the neck and all but one were done with the neck attached to the guitar. There are sound reasons for fretting on the neck; leveling the fretboard in place is probably the primary reason and Dan Erlewine explains this a lot better than me.

My first build was a kit and I decided to do what I knew best and I fretted on the neck. The frets south of the heel of the neck are not a lot of fun to place.

I'll be doing the next one with a Jaws II press with the board off of the neck. My hope is that there will be less fret dressing involved. Fretting turns out to be an artform all on its own. The conclusion that I've come to is that it may not matter which way one goes about it, other than how well one can accomplish the task.

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Jim Howell
Charlotte, NC

I have done it both ways and like fretting before I glue the fingerboard to the neck. I have not had any problems at all using this approach. I use my drill press with a fret caul and have very little to no leveling or dressing to do afterward except for the fret ends. I don't glue my frets.

Mike

Both ways work just fine. It really comes down to which way feels best to
you. For me, I like to do arbor press the frets before I attach the
fretboard to the neck. If you do it this way, you have to make sure you
can achieve the following:

1) A perfect neck angle. A neck-body hump is caused by poor
methodology. You really need to be able to achieve a flawless line from
the neck to the upper bout. If you can't do this yet, you should fret after
the fretboard is attached.

2) A perfectly level fretboard. Really, this is helpful for both methods but
is particularly important if you fret before gluing. Because you really
don't want to waste fret height trying to get the frets level.

3) You need a fretboard gluing caul to eliminate the possibility of
backbow introduced in the gluing process. I think Watkins sells them but
they are easy to make - just make sure it is perfectly flat.

I find it very important to not install the frets in two fret locations. I use
locating pins to align the fretboard during glue-up. I then install those
two frets after glue-up.

As I said before, I really do think it is just a personal preference thing. I
feel more comfortable being able to press the frets in and I get wonderful
results this way.

If you really want to improve you fretting, I've found that StewMac's
Aluminum fret leveling tool is very nice.

Peace Out,
Simon

Thank you all.

David, you mentioned that I should use Epoxy if I fret before hand. Is this just regular 2 part (5 minute) Expoy, or is there a certain type of Epoxy that I should look for?

If I fret afterwards (which I'm leaning towards after hearing the "if you're not 100%" comments), can I use Tightbond, or should I also use the Epoxy for that as well? What do most of you use with great success?

As I mentioned above, it sounds like I should at least try installing the frets after the fret board is attached to the neck since I'm not 100% confident that I will have everything perfect. It's my first build so I'm more likely than not, to make plenty of mistakes.

I assume that I should glue the fingerboard to the top and have the neck attached in all regards before fretting? (I should not fret and then remove the neck to apply the glue between the fretboard and the top?)

I was glad to hear Michael's comment on fretting being a "tapping operation" and not a "hammering" one. This takes away some of the worries that I had of damaging the guitar while trying to "hammer" frets in.

I have a fingerboard that I ruined while trying to slot on my first attempt so I think it would be a good idea for me to saw a few slots and try fretting those to get the feel of things.

Thank you all for your thoughts.

Once again, everyone on the OLF has been wonderful. I look forward to a continuing relationship and hope that I too can help out one day.

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Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."