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Joshua--

Another thank you for reposting this tutorial. I've been collecting information on this style of neck joint for a week or so and what a delight to see this post.

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Jim Howell
Charlotte, NC

That's inspirational as are your rosettes....well, and I guess everything else
I've seen on your website. Thanks for sharing! You've helped me redefine
"classical" and given me an appreciation for tradition.
Danny Vincent

Lance how about adding this to the Jigs Tools and Techniques section?


Joshua

Stunning work as always. Thanks for updating this tutorial.

[QUOTE=Anthony Z] the dowel was an after thought for added insurance.[/QUOTE]
You won't need it. I've never heard of a dowel being used in any old extant guitar that used this joint. Remember, old-world builders were at least as smart as we are, and I'm sure that something like that had been considered and rejected long ago.

It's my understanding that the "V" joint was used extensively because it was the strongest anyone could come up with, given the imprecision of tools, humidity control and glue of the time. Those builders would have tried everything, and this is what they settled on. In fact, it works much the same way as does a dovetail joint--mechanical strength in addition to glue strength--and dovetails are still acknowledged as the strongest, non hardware, joint in Western woodworking. The scarf joint became popular after the invention of modern glues, and because it's easier to execute. Since it offers no mechanical strength, it relies exclusively on the glue. It works fine, but it's not as nifty! The scarf does, like the "V", give us an all long-grain headstock, which IMO is much stronger than a one-piece neck/headstock.

Joshua,

Thanks. This one was even easier to follow than the first.

Joshua, very nice tutorial, very well laid out. One point that I've always pondered with this joint, and you as a pro kind of glossed over it, is the fitting of the head piece to the neck piece. There are two pieces to my question:

1) once you have the projecting V on the neck, how do you lay out the corresponding V-notch to the head? Is the notch passing through the head in a compound line that is parallel to the butt end of the head, or is it cut perpendicular to the face and then the projecting V on the neck cut to a compound line to match it?

2) Once you have cut the end/butt angle on the head and oversize roughed it's V notch, one assumes that you then sneak up on the fit of the V till it and the butt part are "just right". This always looked like a place for someone like me to end up chasing my tail where I go bit too far on the V and have to re-cut the butt to then go a bit to far on the V and ...you get the idea. Particularly since your cut with the chisel is shearing into the end grain of the head if that is the notch that gets fitted as opposed to shaving off the projecting V on the neck, it seems a dificult prospect.

Is the fit of the V actually easier that I am imagining, easier than for example a compound dovetail on a mandolin? Blah blah blah, what a windbag Alan....
TIA,
Alan D.

....bump

Anthony, Thanks for the bump - I'd have missed Alan D.'s questions otherwise.

For the first question, I just mark the same measurements I did for the neckshat onto the headstick, cut it out, smooth it with chisels and then see where I'm at. I continue working with the headstock portion of the neck until the fit is good. I'm not sure I quite understand the rest of this question, but the V itself angles back at the same angle as the cuts in this picture:



For the second question - you can definitely chase your tail on this joint. You probably will, the first time. But it gets easier. Use a wide chisel that has a low angle and is very sharp on the V on the neckshaft (male portion). Its not very difficult to do. One the protruding V is accurate then all the work is done on the head portion. I use a low angle block plane for the end grain there, but a file can be used as well.

It takes some definite fitting. But its ot as intimidating as it may seem.

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Instagram: @jfrenchluthier
Web: https://www.jfrenchguitars.com/

That certainly is a beautiful joint,although according to Cumpiano`s book a scarf joint is more shock resistant than a one piece.
                           James w b

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James W Bolan
Nashville Tennessee

Joshua, many thanks - very much appreciated!

Josh, I'm feeling ignorant....can you show me a pic of your T-bevel?

Thanks....

LOVE that joint. I'd like to try Julius Borges' version of it also, he uses some sort of v in the v part or something like that. Hard to describe, but it's very cool.

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"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Joshua,

One thing that Alan D. is asking (I think) I've wondered about too. It looks like, since you angle the end-grain portion of the neck, you'll leave the end-grain of the headstock square where they meet. Correct? Then what do you do with the "V"? Leave the male and female parts square where they meet, because the gap will be hidden; or, do you angle one so the tip of the "V" will fit snuggly into its counterpart in the headstock?

Carlton, I believe the tip of the male V is cut to the same angle as the shoulders of the male V.

Thanks, Anthony. That's what I wanted to know. I couldn't really tell from the pictures. It seems the most logical approach.

Thanks for the clarification, Joshua. I Think I understand now. I'll have to break out some scrap and give it a go.

Alan D.

Yes, Anthony is correct. The male V is angled the same as the shoulders of the male V.

For the headstock piece everything is cut square, since the angle is already established with the male v.

_________________
Instagram: @jfrenchluthier
Web: https://www.jfrenchguitars.com/

Thanks, Joshua. I just realized...it happens during initial lay-up, doesn't it? D'oh!!!