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| Wood binding in electric oven for bending? http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=55949 |
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| Author: | Map63 [ Wed Oct 04, 2023 8:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
I have some walnut binding but I don't have a bending iron or heating blanket. I do have a used curling iron I will try, but if that does not work I want to try using my electric oven. I saw a few videos where the binding was dampened and wrapped in aluminum foil before bending. What's the opinion if I dampen and wrap the binding, then heat the wood in my electric oven? I planned on 170º for about an hour then taping it to the binding channel. Thank you, Mike |
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Wed Oct 04, 2023 10:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Get a pipe cutoff and a blow torch. I had a buddy that used to bend bow laminations on a pot… |
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| Author: | Bryan Bear [ Wed Oct 04, 2023 11:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Are you making this guitar or just binding an existing guitar? I’m kind of assuming you are making the guitar and had pre bent sides. If that is the case, I strongly encourage you to make a hot pipe. There are a few ways to do it for very little money. Once you finish your first guitar, there willl be another one in your future and you are eventually going to want to add bending into your bag of tricks. Best to make the pipe now and practice with it and start building those skills. Early on in the hobby for me I tended to think of my projects in terms of the end result instead of an enjoyable past time. I spent too much effort trying to figure out a way to get by and get a task done through some shortcut or alternative means. I always ended up eventually learning one or more of the mainstream approaches and being glad I finally did. Could you wrap binding in foil, bake it and get it clamped into a channel before it cools? Maybe. But spending $20 to make a hot pipe and learning to bend on it is not as hard as it might sound and will be something you will be glad you did. Spend some time practicing on some scrap too. If you only have enough actual binding strips on hand to do the guitar, you’ll be less likely to break them with practice. Walnut is pretty easy to bend but until you get the feel for it, you can still get yourself into trouble. |
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| Author: | Hesh [ Thu Oct 05, 2023 2:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
An oven is not suitable on a number of levels so I don't want to further this idea but I do want to offer an alternative and that is make your own bending iron, very inexpensive to do. Ed's suggestion above is what I would do. Walnut is one of the easiest woods to bend and a good learning experience but an oven is again not suitable. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Thu Oct 05, 2023 8:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Another thing you could try if you have a short length of pipe or tubing and a tea kettle would be to make a "steam box" and steam bend the wood. Rather than taping it into the binding channel you might need to make a form with a channel cut in the shape of the half profile of the guitar that you can bend the strip into before it starts to cool. Making a bending iron might be less problematic. I have bent binding strips and mandolin sides over the metal end of a heat gun. The small diameter of the metal end is not ideal but by moving the wood back and forth to heat a longer length of the wood (as you go on a bending iron) and gradually bending the wood a reasonable outcome can be achieved. If I wanted to bind a guitar without using a bending iron or heat blanket I would use plastic binding - but I use plastic binding most of the time anyway - it is so much easier and I feel more protective of the edge.YMMV |
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| Author: | bobgramann [ Thu Oct 05, 2023 9:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
With the small mass of the binding, its heat retention for bending will be very disappointing with both the oven and the steam bending method. The bending iron allows you to bend while heat is applied. Any of the bending iron approaches described above will give you results. A larger pipe, 2 - 2.5”, will make you job easier since rocking your binding over it will heat a larger area and distribute the bend making breaking much less likely. The curling iron is not likely to do much for you since the heat you need (250-350F) is likely to singe hair. As Bryan said, get some scrap and cut it thin like your binding for practice. Once you conquer the process, you might think it’s fun. Bending is one of the parts of building I enjoy the most. |
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| Author: | bluescreek [ Thu Oct 05, 2023 1:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
use a steam iron and a pipe the steam gets the wood plyable with the steam then with dry heat you can set the bend on the pipe you will have to practice a bit but you will get it. You can use the iron with a hot pipe |
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| Author: | Kbore [ Thu Oct 05, 2023 2:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
How thick is your binding? Is it solid walnut? What are you binding with it? For me, hardwood binding on the large curves of an acoustic is hard enough to get a tight fit, even with heated benders and forms. Your wood will likely cool off before you get a side done. If you do use a torch, don't use galvanized pipe.... |
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| Author: | Map63 [ Sun Oct 08, 2023 12:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Thank you for the help. I will take the advice and not use the oven. I'm looking for a pipe and heating element. |
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| Author: | profchris [ Sun Oct 08, 2023 2:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Map63 wrote: Thank you for the help. I will take the advice and not use the oven. I'm looking for a pipe and heating element. I've bent a fair few sides on a hot pipe which is just (a) a length of steel tube salvaged from a trailer jockey wheel, and (b) a heat gun blowing down the pipe. |
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| Author: | Hesh [ Sun Oct 08, 2023 7:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Map63 wrote: Thank you for the help. I will take the advice and not use the oven. I'm looking for a pipe and heating element. Good move. We see a lot of new folks attempting to reinvent the wheel or a process. There is a reason why things such as a hot pipe have been used for hundreds of years - it works. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sun Oct 08, 2023 10:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
If you are just bending bindings, another "off beat" (i.e. somewhat crazy) idea might be to use a charcoal starter: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Expert-Grill ... SellerId=0 You might need to stabilize it by clamping the handle to something (the grill?) so you can apply a little bit of force against it but for bindings you shouldn't need to push too hard. I don't think I would try bending sides with it, but IIRC something similar to a pipe filled with burning embers was used before the advent of propane torches. |
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| Author: | Bryan Bear [ Fri Oct 13, 2023 11:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Clay S. wrote: If you are just bending bindings, another "off beat" (i.e. somewhat crazy) idea might be to use a charcoal starter: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Expert-Grill ... SellerId=0 You might need to stabilize it by clamping the handle to something (the grill?) so you can apply a little bit of force against it but for bindings you shouldn't need to push too hard. I don't think I would try bending sides with it, but IIRC something similar to a pipe filled with burning embers was used before the advent of propane torches. Clay, are you talking about just bending on the charcoal starter element itself? That seems dangerous to me. I use a charcoal starter crammed in a chunk of steel pipe. I just gently crimped it in my vice until it was a snug fit inside the pipe and I hold the whole thing in a vice while I bend. BUT. . . I run the charcoal starter through a dimmer switch and don't bend with it "running full throttle." I keep meaning to make a nicer set up but I never get around to it. This cost me about $20 and 15 mins of work and gets the job done perfectly. . . |
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| Author: | Ken Nagy [ Fri Oct 13, 2023 1:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
For years bending violin sides and purfling, I used a shaped hunk of aluminum heated by a heat gun. I made a little base for the gun to fit in. A piece of pipe would probably be easier to find. |
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| Author: | RusRob [ Fri Oct 13, 2023 2:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wood binding in electric oven for bending? |
Clay S. wrote: Clay, are you talking about just bending on the charcoal starter element itself? That seems dangerous to me. I use a charcoal starter crammed in a chunk of steel pipe. I just gently crimped it in my vice until it was a snug fit inside the pipe and I hold the whole thing in a vice while I bend. BUT. . . I run the charcoal starter through a dimmer switch and don't bend with it "running full throttle." I keep meaning to make a nicer set up but I never get around to it. This cost me about $20 and 15 mins of work and gets the job done perfectly. . . This is the setup I use and it works great. I am using 2 1/2" stainless steel automotive exhaust pipe just longer than the element of the charcoal lighter. I hammered the round pipe into an oval to give me more surface area and it is connected to a router variable adjust controller. Harbor Freight use to carry them but they don't anymore... However Menards has the exact same one so you should be able to get one there. Here is a link to the controller https://www.menards.com/main/tools/power-tools/routers/variable-speed-controller-for-power-tools/80820/p-1444421810442-c-10087.htm This is probably the cheapest / safest way to do it without buying a purpose built one from a supplier ($$$$). Cheers, Bob |
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