Makes sense to me since it's on the cutaway side. I'm almost with rlrhett that it might be considered a mistake by some. The slope is steep enough though that it should be clear it was a design. Maybe make it even more steep (steeper
)? I like it.
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| Author: | sdsollod [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 12:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Before I commit to the heel design on this guitar I thought I'd get some opinions. Perhaps it's unconventional, but I like to add some flair without deviating from accepted norms. However, I don't like to feel like, "what was I thinking?" after the project is completed. I could just make it symetrical... So, what's your opinion, ugly, stupid, interesting, inspiring? |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
For what its worth every cutaway neck order we have taken and produced are for the exact look you posted. Sorry this is a correction/edit -- I just glanced at the pixs at first on my smart phone, should have looked closer. Indeed my customers want the heel symmetrical not what you have posted, BTW that's not for me either. |
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| Author: | Rodger Knox [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
I usually carve the heel asymmetrically to facilitate playing access, although I don't usually continue it all the way to the heel cap. |
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| Author: | rlrhett [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Personally, no. I don't like the asymmetry. It would bother me a lot. I think if it somehow match other lines in the guitar it might look ok. To me it just looks like a mistake. |
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| Author: | bcombs510 [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Makes sense to me since it's on the cutaway side. I'm almost with rlrhett that it might be considered a mistake by some. The slope is steep enough though that it should be clear it was a design. Maybe make it even more steep (steeper )? I like it.
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| Author: | DennisK [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 2:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Hmm, the overall impression is off balance to me. I would have done it the other way around (heel cap longer on the cutaway side) so the heel cap and cutaway counterbalance eachother, aesthetically speaking. Shouldn't affect playability since you can blend to a symmetrical profile at the heel to neck transition where the thumb contacts it. So for this one, I'd say make it symmetrical. But it's an artistic choice, so if you like it this way, then go for it
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| Author: | J De Rocher [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 2:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
I don't care for it. To me the shape clashes with the body shape and I agree it looks more like a mistake than intentional. I do remember once seeing an asymmetrical heel that I liked, but I'll have to look to see if I can find a photo of it. If it was me, I would make the profile of the bass side match that of the cutaway side. |
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| Author: | sdsollod [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 4:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Okay... easy to simply carve it symmetrically... I have tried things in the past with the intention of being distinctive, but later I wished I hadn't done it that way. This may be one of those times... Thanks for the feedback. |
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| Author: | J De Rocher [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 6:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Ok, I didn't find the photo of the heel I had in mind, but the one on this Everett guitar is similar. Attachment: Everett asymmetrical heel.JPG This other Everett heel is interesting because the neck block is relieved with a vertical taper on the cutaway side in addition to the heel being asymmetric. Attachment: Everett asymmetrical heel 2.JPG The Matsuda heel below is shaped similar to what Dennis mentioned above and it's heavily scalloped on the cutaway side above the bottom of the heel. Personally I don't care for the look when viewed straight on from the back, but the scalloping makes it look good from other angles, and functional. Attachment: Matsuda asymmetrical heel 3.jpg Attachment: Matsuda asymmetrical heel 4.jpg This Jang heel is like the one you posted but with more subtle curves. Attachment: Jang assymmetric heel 2.jpg Raimundo uses an interesting heel on some models in which the heel is basically symmetric, but the neck body joint is asymmetric. I would like to see the inside of this to see how it's done. Attachment: Raimundo 630 assymetric heel 2.jpg Lastly, check this one out. No separate heel block. Attachment: DeHart assymmetric heel 2.jpg
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| Author: | sdsollod [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 6:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Hey, certainly some of those are quite interesting. Thanks for posting them. Maybe mine needs more distictive character, but it's really not that much different... Seems like symetrical is like everyone else's. I tried to carve the heel to provide comfort. Seems like the one carved on the other side, while looking appealing, doesn't give you the same reach. |
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| Author: | sdsollod [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 6:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Maybe the lamination in the neck causes a visual distraction... |
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| Author: | JSDenvir [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 7:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
I'd make the asymmetry really obvious. To quote Stephen King, "god hates a coward." Steve |
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| Author: | Shane Neifer [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 7:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Hey Steve. I don't mind what you have there at all. Symmetry is much less important to me than balance. Yours looks almost balanced to me. I could offer my opinion of what would make it more appealing to me but as is I would say "hey, that dude was thinking about how to maximize the cutaway....cool!" Thanks Shane |
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| Author: | dzsmith [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Looks wonky or unintentional to me. |
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| Author: | Joe Beaver [ Thu Mar 30, 2017 10:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
One man's wonky is an others art.... but, I'm going with Dan. To me it is just to close to normal, making me lean toward 'a comfort design', which, when you think about it is not bad at all! |
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| Author: | sdsollod [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 8:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
I love some of the designs that Jay posted, but i guess I'm not there (at that level) yet. Purhaps the laminations distract. I noted the ones in the photos don't have them. In any case... I'll carve it symetrical on this one. Thanks for all the feedback. ...Who else am I going to ask? |
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| Author: | jfmckenna [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 9:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
I think the center stripe of the neck is what makes it look awkward. That center stripe is asking for symmetry. Otherwise I think you could get away with it. J De Rocher wrote: Lastly, check this one out. No separate heel block. Attachment: DeHart assymmetric heel 2.jpg But that strap button. ![[uncle]](./images/smilies/surrenderflagqv6.gif "Uncle") 
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| Author: | Colin North [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 10:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
I though it looked fine - as it is. |
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| Author: | Don Williams [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Who cares if it's asymmetrical or symmetrical? The question is do YOU like it? The rules aren't set in stone. This is as much art and design as anything else. Is everything else on the guitar symmetrical or asymmetrical? How does it work with the whole thing? I know many artists and graphic designers who have no problem with using things that are "out of balance" to achieve their ends. |
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| Author: | Tim L [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 6:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
I guess I would ask myself if being asymmetrical added anything. I get the functional part about being lower by the cut, I I really like the looks of that, but why a bulkier heel on the bass side? My personal taste would be to make the heel more symmetrical for a traditional acoustic. |
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| Author: | Terence Kennedy [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 10:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
How does it feel in the playing position? If it adds functionality I'd say go for it. If just an artistic statement I'd vote for symmetrical. |
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| Author: | Dave m2 [ Wed Apr 05, 2017 4:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Cutaway Heel Design Opinion |
Sorry if this is a bit of an old thread but I was fascinated by Jay's collection of heel shapes. My initial reaction to the OP's question was that once you have done that cutaway, the player has the access he/she needs so there is no need to mess with the shape of the heel. In other words we have dealt with the functionality and the rest is aesthetics so, as people have said, it's just down to what the builder likes. However the more I looked at those rather wonderful heel shapes from Jay, as a player I could just feel my left hand thumb curling into those dips and dishes in a very comfortable, even comforting way. You would certainly be reminded where you are on the neck and it could even be that a little pocket for the thumb would reduce that stretch to the high frets for the fretting fingers. So maybe there is some functionality to justify some slightly, to my eyes, odd shapes. Dave |
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