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| Steel String finish http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=47878 |
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| Author: | REvans [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Steel String finish |
Hey folks - I just completed a classical with Royal Lac, and really like this finish. I have a steel string up next and I am wondering if this finish would be suitable. Anyone out there using Royal Lac on SS's? Is it durable enough? My other thought is to give Enduro-var a try, but i have no real experience with WB finishes and would be brushing it as I do not have spray equipment. Thanks in advance! |
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| Author: | doncaparker [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
Rob-- Two things: 1. Your question implies a factual assumption that a natural (i.e., no additives) shellac is not durable enough for a steel string. I know that there are people who feel that way, but not everyone feels that way. I don't feel that way. I feel that, all things considered, shellac is a great finish for a steel string guitar. Is the finish going to age and wear differently from other finishes? Yes. But I like those differences, all things considered. Just thought a bit of questioning assumptions was in order. 2. I have used Royal Lac on a steel string, and I like how it turned out. I can't tell you how much more durable it is than regular shellac, because I have not tested its limits. But others have, and the results are impressive. |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 8:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
Enduro varnish cannot be/should not be brushed ---- General Finish documents state it is a spray on coating. |
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| Author: | Colin North [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
kencierp wrote: Enduro varnish cannot be/should not be brushed ---- General Finish documents state it is a spray on coating. Maybe you got some wires crossed with that Ken? From their website - Quote: Enduro-Var top coat, a modified oil urethane in a water system, is our premium urethane water base top coat. This is a highly advanced self crosslinking system. Check out our blog posts here for details on Endurovar projects from our customers.
Sheens: Flat, satin, semi-gloss and gloss sheens. Color tone: Amber Application: Acrylic brush, foam brush, paint pad applicator, or spray Recoat: 4 hours |
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| Author: | SteveSmith [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
I have two steel strings that I finished with Royal Lac. I really like the finish although I had some problems related to me spraying too fast. I sprayed 3 coats a day at 20 minute intervals. I will use RL on my next guitar too but I will French polish it or spray as Vijay recommends below. If you decide to spray, here's what Vijay at Shellac Finishes had to say about spraying: Quote: As you mention, it is the 20 minute interval that is the cause. Several points to keep in mind:
1) Spraying a 2 lb cut finish is a lot of solids at one time. About 20-21% solids by weight. 2) Spraying can be light or heavy. Everyone sprays differently. 3) Even though after 20 minutes it feels dry, it is still wet under that thin upper skin. 4) Even a 2lb cut of pure shellac flakes will craze when sprayed so quickly. I spray no more than 3 coats a day with at least 3 hours in between. Many a times I limit it to 2 coats only. If you French Polish or apply with a pad, a wet coat will instantly give you feedback by not letting the pad slide easily and/or observe some removal of the previous coat. This feedback mechanism is not available to a finisher who is spraying. Royal-Lac is not a catalyzed finish. It is dependent on evaporation. Evaporation is directly related to the ambient conditions. Hence going slow while spraying will always help. Hope this helps. |
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| Author: | doncaparker [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 10:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
On the one guitar where I used Royal Lac, I first tried the brushing method, but I was unhappy with how it went on. When I switched to applying it via French polish technique, it worked really well. That's the only way I will put it on if I work with it again. |
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| Author: | Bryan Bear [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 11:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
Over at the MIMF there is a thread about endouro-var. The user was quite pleased with it as a brushed on finish. He even like his initial test pieces where he just wiped it on with a paper towel. I have not yet used either Royal-lac or EV, but I am likely to switch to one of them the next time I have something ready for finish (I just haven't decided yet). |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 1:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
Quote: Maybe you got some wires crossed with that Ken? Sure did -- I stand corrected, sorry to confuse -- I was looking at my conversion varnish notes. |
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| Author: | bcombs510 [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 2:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
I just bailed out on FP and put Enduro-Var on my second build. I have to say, if you can get your hands on a sprayer (I use the Earlex spray station) the stuff goes on really great. I'm still a noob but I think leveling on this go around will be much easier than the first build. Attachment: IMG_0651.JPG I'm going to level and buff this guy up over the weekend. Can't wait!! |
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| Author: | Hesh [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
In my view the best steel string finishes are very much dependent on who's going to be playing the thing and where.... For example my favorite guitar that I built has a very thin shellac finish as Don seems to favor above and I agree. Shellac is not only thin or can be applied that way in my view it's as acoustically transparent as any finish that I have "not" heard.... OTOH I take care of my stuff, rarely drool scotch although that's been happening a bit lately...., and my guitars rarely leave home and live in RH controlled environments. How would shellac do for a gigging musician who is a band member on the road often and the instrument is in and out of uncontrolled RH environments? It would likely suck.... and be dent prone with roady rash, etc. For a gigging musician where they are amplified and tone is not the number one consideration cat poly is pretty tough and desirable in my view. For the rest of us mere mortals nitro was and is a pretty good solution. It's easy to apply even for a novice and does not require elaborate protective gear. It will last around 100 years before we are SOL but who cares at that point because in the long run..... well you know..... It's interesting to me to see this discussion occur over and over again on all forums over time. Ten years ago folks talked about enduro too back when it was manufactured to finish floors..... Every couple of years someone comes up with something that is supposed to be new and lots of folks try it with differing results. My impression of this over a decade now is that two of the very best finishes remain nitro and shellac. Go figure. |
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| Author: | REvans [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 5:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
Thanks everyone for the feedback, food for thought. I reviewed the thread on the MIMF on Endur Var - very interesting. I think I will try to be logical and sane and stick with Royal Lac and get some Enduro var and experiment with it , but not on a guitar! |
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| Author: | meddlingfool [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 5:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Steel String finish |
Don't forget the royal lac is supposed to be impervious to scotch drool. |
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