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I've seen the light...
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=47851
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Author:  B. Howard [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 6:21 am ]
Post subject:  I've seen the light...

No, I didn't go see Brother Cloephus.....

But I Have seen the light, The UV light! I have just finished setting up my new UV finish curing system. We are currently only using it for pore fill and base coat but I will be trying out some of the topcoats in another month or so.

There is a definite learning curve, this stuff is different from anything else I ever used and I've used it all from pumice & shellac and shellac to spayable polyesters. Should have made this leap years ago..... Completely green technology ( at least on my end...), no fumes, VOC's or HAP's. No cleaning spray equipment, no instantly clogged booth filters either. And efficient? My, yes! A quart of filler will do at least 50 guitars by the looks of it!

Author:  kencierp [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 7:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Pictures of the system?

Thanks

Author:  Michaeldc [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 7:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Who's system did you settle on?

Thanks

Author:  B. Howard [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 9:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Went with system to start out. http://www.uv3.com/products/mobile-handheld-uv/cure-buddy

Using isolator and UV gel filler from Cardinal.

Author:  kencierp [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 11:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Seems as though the link and UV3 site are dead?

Fixed --- local problem windows DNS settings

Author:  SteveSmith [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 11:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

link worked just fine for me

Author:  kencierp [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 11:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Google Chrome Problem fixed --- windows DNS settings

Image

Author:  J De Rocher [ Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

B. Howard wrote:
No cleaning spray equipment, no instantly clogged booth filters either.


Is this because the filler and base coat don't set up at all without the UV?

Author:  B. Howard [ Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

J De Rocher wrote:
B. Howard wrote:
No cleaning spray equipment, no instantly clogged booth filters either.


Is this because the filler and base coat don't set up at all without the UV?


The Isolation coat is very thin and does not surface load the filters like heavier vinyl sealers. But mainly because the filler isn't sprayed.....it is a wipe on type product. The sprayable peroxide cured polyesters like simtec are very thick and gel quickly thereby clogging paint arrestors almost instantly.

Author:  Colin North [ Sun Jun 05, 2016 7:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Just wondering what sort of investment you're looking at - didn't dsee anything on the website.

Author:  Michaeldc [ Sun Jun 05, 2016 8:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Colin North wrote:
Just wondering what sort of investment you're looking at - didn't dsee anything on the website.


I'm also curious what the final number was. They say somewhere in the neighborhood of $2000 on the website.

Author:  B. Howard [ Mon Jun 06, 2016 5:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Yep right around $2000 for the lighting and another couple hundred for materials.

Author:  kencierp [ Mon Jun 06, 2016 4:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Since this curing technology has become popular for use in beauty salons (nail techs) -- the LED lights of the proper frequency are now readily available -- 50,000 hour life! which is much better than the CFL tubes. I am pretty happy with Zpoxy but the ultra fast dry of the UV cure filler is very intriguing -- I just may try and make a curing unit -- $2000 is out of the question for our shop since I only build for family these days.

Author:  Robbie O'Brien [ Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

I know of a couple of people selling their UV lamps. Contact me for more info.

Author:  B. Howard [ Tue Jun 07, 2016 7:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

kencierp wrote:
Since this curing technology has become popular for use in beauty salons (nail techs) -- the LED lights of the proper frequency are now readily available -- 50,000 hour life! which is much better than the CFL tubes. I am pretty happy with Zpoxy but the ultra fast dry of the UV cure filler is very intriguing -- I just may try and make a curing unit -- $2000 is out of the question for our shop since I only build for family these days.


I doubt the lights they use at the nail salons are powerful enough to cure these materials.... This light is industrial. Throws a light much like an arc welder.

Author:  Michaeldc [ Tue Jun 07, 2016 7:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

B. Howard wrote:
No, I didn't go see Brother Cloephus.....

But I Have seen the light, The UV light! I have just finished setting up my new UV finish curing system. We are currently only using it for pore fill and base coat but I will be trying out some of the topcoats in another month or so.

There is a definite learning curve, this stuff is different from anything else I ever used and I've used it all from pumice & shellac and shellac to spayable polyesters. Should have made this leap years ago..... Completely green technology ( at least on my end...), no fumes, VOC's or HAP's. No cleaning spray equipment, no instantly clogged booth filters either. And efficient? My, yes! A quart of filler will do at least 50 guitars by the looks of it!


Brian,

Have you tried pore filling wenge or paduak yet? Ive read that deeper pores can be problem due to the light not penetrating deep enough. I've also heard that uv cure finish can be a tone killer. I look forward to hearing more over the coming months.

Thanks for sharing, Michael

Author:  kencierp [ Tue Jun 07, 2016 8:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Quote:
I doubt the lights they use at the nail salons are powerful enough to cure these materials.... This light is industrial. Throws a light much like an arc welder.


The comment is in regard to UVA component availability --- if one has the wherewithal to use them a device of any power output and UVA light spectrum wave length range can be constructed.

Author:  kencierp [ Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Quote:
" uv cure finish can be a tone killer"


Sounds like something that might said by those that can't afford the technology --- Negative Marketing

Author:  Michaeldc [ Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

kencierp wrote:
Quote:
" uv cure finish can be a tone killer"


Sounds like something that might said by those that can't afford the technology --- Negative Marketing


Could be... Second hand info a the very least.

Author:  Michaeldc [ Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Robbie O'Brien wrote:
I know of a couple of people selling their UV lamps. Contact me for more info.


Robbie,

I sent you a PM regarding a used lights.

Thanks, Michael

Author:  B. Howard [ Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Michaeldc wrote:

Brian,

Have you tried pore filling wenge or paduak yet? Ive read that deeper pores can be problem due to the light not penetrating deep enough. I've also heard that uv cure finish can be a tone killer. I look forward to hearing more over the coming months.

Thanks for sharing, Michael


Deeper pores seem to need a third coat to fill level but I did not see any problems on the Ash test panel I ran and then cut up and ash has some of the worst grain to fill. Uncured has been a problem at times, usually because the product was put on too thick or wasn't cooked long enough. A good Isolante as an initial sealer will prevent pore bleed if some of the filler doesn't quite cook all the way.As for a tone killer? I highly doubt it. Taylor has been using the stuff for 20+ years and all the major makers are using this tech on at least some of their guitars.

Author:  Michaeldc [ Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

B. Howard wrote:
No, I didn't go see Brother Cloephus.....

But I Have seen the light, The UV light! I have just finished setting up my new UV finish curing system. We are currently only using it for pore fill and base coat but I will be trying out some of the topcoats in another month or so.

There is a definite learning curve, this stuff is different from anything else I ever used and I've used it all from pumice & shellac and shellac to spayable polyesters. Should have made this leap years ago..... Completely green technology ( at least on my end...), no fumes, VOC's or HAP's. No cleaning spray equipment, no instantly clogged booth filters either. And efficient? My, yes! A quart of filler will do at least 50 guitars by the looks of it!


Brian,

I understand one is encouraged not to expose the filler to an ignition source. What safety gear are you using before cooking, and once cooked is the filler now benign with no offgassing?

Thanks,

Michael

Author:  B. Howard [ Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've seen the light...

Michaeldc wrote:
Brian,

I understand one is encouraged not to expose the filler to an ignition source. What safety gear are you using before cooking, and once cooked is the filler now benign with no offgassing?

Thanks,

Michael


There are no fumes and no off-gassing even before curing. The product is 99% solids so it is completely without any solvents whatsoever in it. I really don't see much chance of ignition unless you drop a spoonful of the stuff on your cigar...... Vinyl gloves is about it for safety gear during the application.

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