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| Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=47604 |
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| Author: | fingerstyle1978 [ Sat Apr 09, 2016 1:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
I recently got my first full size neck blank, mainly because I was tired of laminating the blocks to stack for the heel and I've never been happy with the look I was getting doing so. I'm ready to cut the blank but I got thinking about whether I still needed to scarf the head or not. Is the scarf joint for strength or for ease of setting the correct angle of the head? Has anyone done this both ways and if so what's the preference. If not then what's a good reason not to have one solid piece neck? |
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| Author: | sdsollod [ Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
If you get a 3"x4"x30" neck blank. I see no reason to cut a scarf joint. I would simply cut out 2 solid neck blanks with angled heads. I typically add a volute which strengthens that area... |
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| Author: | roby [ Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
Same here,i just cut 2 necks from one 3×4 blank ,never liked scarf joints and stacked heels . |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Sat Apr 09, 2016 3:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
You want a blank with the grain lines perpendicular to the fingerboard surface this yields the strongest transition going to the head stock slope. When the truss rod adjuster is at the HS end I'd argue that a scarf joint is stronger and a better choice. 
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| Author: | J De Rocher [ Sat Apr 09, 2016 3:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
If you think you will be working from full size neck blanks in the future and you have a band saw, here's a simple jig you can make and use to get an accurate, square, and smooth cut of the headstock angle on the headplate face: http://luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10117&t=45211 |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sat Apr 09, 2016 5:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
" what's a good reason not to have one solid piece neck?" 1. less waste - even nesting two necks will leave the center section between them as scrap. From the scrap you may get tail blocks, side reinforcements, or what have you so the frugal minded still won't send much to the bin. 2. Better grain orientation with scarf joint. 3. Peghead can be worked on separately with modified bridle joint. 4. Economy - the board foot price for 4/4 rough cut stock is generally cheaper than 12/4 stock. I like to do the bridle joint peghead and a "block" heel glued to a separate neck shaft. I also don't care for the look of the stacked heel, although when well done they don't look bad. A single block glued to the shaft is a compromise. I like to rough shape the peghead before gluing to the neck, so I prefer the bridle joint (which I also think is stronger than a one piece). To each their own, there are plenty of one piece necks that have held up fine. |
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| Author: | Jeff Highland [ Sun Apr 10, 2016 4:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
I scarf, but I don't think the concept that a scarf joint is stronger than a one piece neck is clear cut. When you look at the location of most headstock breaks, they are in the transition zone between neck shaft and headstock. Most people are locating their scarfs just beyond the e tuner holes(I do it in the neck/volute zone), so effectively the breaks occur before the scarf joint. When it comes to break resistance some of the major factors are IMHO -don't do the Gibson style truss rod nut access -don't do classic Gibson 17 degree headstocks, even 15 is not really necessary, I use 13 -don't have any runout relative to the fretboard surface of the neck, if you stack 10 degrees here on top of 15 at the headstock you will have serious short grain in the headstock. |
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| Author: | wbergman [ Sun Apr 10, 2016 7:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
My classical Kohno 30 neck/head is from a solid block. It's a top of the line guitar. Heel is built up (one piece) and the interior block is separate. I assume there is a spline joining at the body. |
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| Author: | Jim Kirby [ Sun Apr 10, 2016 8:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
kencierp wrote: You want a blank with the grain lines perpendicular to the fingerboard surface this yields the strongest transition going to the head stock slope. When the truss rod adjuster is at the HS end I'd argue that a scarf joint is stronger and a better choice. OMG what a waste of wood. I'm so glad I build in the classical world where stacked heels are the norm and our blanks are 1 by 3 by 30. If I had a 3 by 3 by 30 blank in hand, I'd resaw it into 3 1 by 3 by 30 blanks quickly and have 3 guitar necks instead of 2. |
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| Author: | J De Rocher [ Sun Apr 10, 2016 9:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
To be fair, that drawing greatly exaggerates the size of the leftover piece in the center. See the photo below for a better idea of its actual size. I have found ways to use that center piece so it's not actually wasted. 
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| Author: | kencierp [ Sun Apr 10, 2016 9:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
Quote: To be fair, that drawing greatly exaggerates the size of the leftover piece in the center. Exactly |
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| Author: | fingerstyle1978 [ Sun Apr 10, 2016 11:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
Jim Kirby wrote: kencierp wrote: You want a blank with the grain lines perpendicular to the fingerboard surface this yields the strongest transition going to the head stock slope. When the truss rod adjuster is at the HS end I'd argue that a scarf joint is stronger and a better choice. OMG what a waste of wood. I'm so glad I build in the classical world where stacked heels are the norm and our blanks are 1 by 3 by 30. If I had a 3 by 3 by 30 blank in hand, I'd resaw it into 3 1 by 3 by 30 blanks quickly and have 3 guitar necks instead of 2. It comes to about 20 extra bucks for 2 solid cut yourself necks vs. scarf and stack blanks. To me the aesthetics are worth it. Also- who doesn't love to have scrap mahogany laying around? I love the stuff and the scraps are welcome for all types of appointment design ect. |
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| Author: | Jim Kirby [ Mon Apr 11, 2016 5:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Question about large neck blanks/scarf joints |
Yes, the piece left in the middle can be used for end blocks or other things. Actually, given that the blanks are 3 by 4 rather than 3 by 3, I'd get 4 necks with not enough left over for anything. As far as aesthetics, I admit to being a product of my chosen building path. I like the stacked heel better than a solid heel. Go figure. |
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