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| Binding tape http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=47349 |
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| Author: | truckjohn [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 3:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Binding tape |
Hey all What's the current binding tape of choice. I have been making due by doubling up blue painters tape - but it's too much hassle. I am ready to move on up to the big time. I was going to go with stew mac's binding tape - but keep reading that they changed their recipe and the current tape does not hold well. LMI is out of stock. Lee valley seems to be selling what looks like 3m #299 or 233 automotive masking tape. What is the right stuff for a good strong hold without gooey residue. Thanks |
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| Author: | Pat Foster [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 3:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
I, and many others, have switched to strapping tape, used to tape up shipping boxes. It has a lengthwise "grain" of strong fiber and is impossible to tear. Soft woods, especially top woods, need a coat of shellac to minimize tearing up grain during removal. Hope that helps. Pat |
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| Author: | truckjohn [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 3:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Any old strapping tape or is there a good one that you like. |
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| Author: | Bobby M [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 4:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Any strapping tape will do. I had good success using the green FrogTape for joining backs and holding bindings etc. Didn't have issues with tearout using it. |
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| Author: | Alex Kleon [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 4:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
I used the FrogTape for joining backs and tops as well. When I ran out, I bought another roll, but the new tape is much much thinner, and doesn't hold as well. I was going to go to L.V. for a roll of the 3M #233 at $8.99/roll. I stopped in at NAPA Auto Parts, and got 4 rolls for $11.87 with tax included! For any Canucks looking for the #233, NAPA's the place to go. Alex |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:30 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
I have always thought the SM tape was hard to beat and use it for all kinds of applications. I just contacted them about the poor feedback and here's the reply: Technical advice <service@stewmac.com> Today at 5:24 PM To Ken Cierpilowski Message body Ken, Thank you for contacting us. We had switched suppliers for the Binding Tape and then, switched again after we discovered the poor functionality of the one mentioned in those reviews. We find the stuff we stock now to be excellent and our customers have had good things to say as well. If you have any other questions or comments, please contact us. Best regards, Spencer Reichley Customer Service Stewart-MacDonald 1-800-848-2273 http://www.stewmac.com |
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| Author: | Colin North [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Bit of a rave, but I just used 3M 1/2" monofilament tape (strapping tape) for the first time today to do a binding job, and I'm now officially a convert (previously used blue tape doubled and then SM binding tape) Good and sticky, but not too difficult to lift (use a shellac coat on the wood and warming it up a bit). And strong - you can really horse as much as you like on it and it just will not tear. If using a tape dispenser (as I do) make sure the cutter is well sharp (in my case a well worn 400 grit Diamond stone and a needle file sharp) and the tape is stuck down securely before pulling to cut a piece off. Otherwise, scissors and cut lotsa bits, then stick ends on whatever handy surface you have. |
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| Author: | Rod True [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
I've got some good strong tape from U-Haul https://www.uhaul.com/MovingSupplies/Ta ... -yard-roll)?mid=143&id=822 and it works well. You just need to find a way to cut the roll. |
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| Author: | J De Rocher [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Well this news about the StewMac tape is a bummer. I bought three rolls of it in October instead of the LMI binding tape by accident. The bad reviews on the SM site go back to September so I guess I'm SOL. I just compared the SM rolls with my remaining LMI roll and the tack of the SM tape is noticeably less. Regarding the LMI tape, I like it a lot. The amount of stick is just right, you can crank down hard on it and it won't break, it has a bit of stretch to it, you can tear it to make the pieces you are going to use rather than cutting with scissors or using a dispenser that has a cutter, and I don't have to shellac the top. I'm sure the blue or green painter's tape works fine for binding in straight runs and mild curves. I have more confidence in the LMI tape for pulling the binding in really tight in tight curves though because it's so strong. |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 5:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Quote: The bad reviews on the SM site go back to September so I guess I'm SOL. As I indicated above SM is aware of the issue --- I bet they will exchange it. |
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| Author: | Alex Kleon [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 6:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Rod True wrote: I've got some good strong tape from U-Haul https://www.uhaul.com/MovingSupplies/Ta ... -yard-roll)?mid=143&id=822 and it works well. You just need to find a way to cut the roll. I took your advice on the U-Haul tape, Rod, I screwed a utility knife blade unto a piece of 3/4" scrap clamped to a bench, and CAREFULLY rotated the roll into the blade. I only managed to get about 1/8" into the roll because the roll started deforming. I think a block of wood in the middle of the roll will give better results. Alex |
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| Author: | Woodie G [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 6:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
We use filament tape, which does not tear or easily cut if the sharp corner on the outside of the binding was not removed in prep, has some 'spring-like' stretch to apply constant pressure once applied, and heat-releases with a hair dryer or heat gun if a coat of shellac gets forgotten in the mad rush to bind. There are several rolls of the brown non-perforated veneer tape like the LMI and Stewart MacDonald products, and I like that as well. All of our tapes are housed in quality U-line holders...each bench gets low tack blue, higher tack blue, and filament (aka strapping) tape on a triple roll dispenser. |
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| Author: | Rocky Road [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 9:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Woodie Sounds like a great way to do it. For anyone married to the brown flat back tape Allen guitars in CA sells a high quality one. Sticks very well. Make sure you use Shellac. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
I like the 3M 2060 green tape for hard to stick surfaces. It is a bit stronger than blue masking tape and it stretches some, so it really holds the pressure well. I have heard though if you use CA for bindings and purfs, the reinforced packing tape is better because CA doesn't stick to it. |
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| Author: | Rod True [ Thu Feb 25, 2016 12:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Oh CA sticks to packing tape. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Thu Feb 25, 2016 3:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Quote: Oh CA sticks to packing tape. I agree --- CA does stick to the filament reinforced tape -- it does not stick to the non-reinforced 2" wide clear stuff. We use the "Duck" brand heavy duty for a release surface on our glue up fixtures. |
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| Author: | Bobc [ Thu Feb 25, 2016 4:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
We've had good reviews from this 3m tape. http://rctonewoods.com/RCT_Store/adhesivestape-c-107/3m-401-high-performance-green-binding-tape-p-8766.html |
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| Author: | Pwoolson [ Thu Feb 25, 2016 9:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Pat Foster wrote: I, and many others, have switched to strapping tape, used to tape up shipping boxes. It has a lengthwise "grain" of strong fiber and is impossible to tear. Soft woods, especially top woods, need a coat of shellac to minimize tearing up grain during removal. Hope that helps. Pat Pat, this is not entirely true. I use it all of the time and once had a set of bindings that were being particularly fussy. I was in the waist and really pulling hard to get the binding to make full contact when *WHAM* the binding actually cut the tape sending my thumb skidding across the top of the guitar. After pulling chunks of wood out from under my thumbnail, I realized that I'd be re topping that instrument due to the huge gouge I left in it. (My tops are only .040" so I can't sand away much of a defect) Wasn't it you that once posted a home-made tape dispenser that held two rolls of tape and then put them together so you only had to pull one strip, which was now doubled? I remember thinking that was brilliant but haven't done anything with the idea...yet. |
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| Author: | Woodie G [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Perhaps Mr. Foster is differentiating between tearing and cutting? Sharp edges on binding will certainly cut filament tape, as will a blade or other sharp edge, but I've found the stuff almost impossible to tear...at least with my hand strength. |
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| Author: | Colin North [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 6:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Mr Woolson said it himself Quote: the binding actually cut the tape
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| Author: | Hesh [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 7:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
Guess I'm the luddite here in so much as I liked the original Stew Mac plain old binding tape and still do. I'm glad to see that someone differentiated what glue one uses too with which tape because that's important. With the brown tape and Titebond I had good results. What I liked about the brown tape is that it's NOT as strong as can be. Imagine that. Why would anyone want a wimpy tape mind you? In my case I would do a dry run taping the binding in place and if at any point I needed more that two, back to back pieces of the brown stuff I fired up the pipe bender and corrected the curvature of the bindings until they fit well with no unnatural acts. Or in other words using lesser tape forced me to make things fit better. Titebond never stuck to the brown tape in my experience and the adhesive released nicely with hair drier heat and shellacking the top and sides in the tape area. |
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| Author: | AndyB [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
In my experience a couple simple things have made a world of difference. 1. a couple coats of dewaxed shellac on the top, keeps it clean but most importantly helps keep from getting tearout. If concerned along the binding edge, quickly swipe an extra coat or two, as it dries super quick. 2. I use the 3M 233+ with good luck. For those using 401+ or 2060 (Bob/Waddy/...) I'd love to know if/how it is better. But the 233+ works well. 3. When removing the tape, I fold it back at a 45 degree angle, which is standard fare in the auto body world, but also addresses the tear issues I have used strapping tape and the stewmac packing tape, but I have found the above simple, versatile (many uses), and highly effective. Andy |
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| Author: | kencierp [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
I only pre-seal if using CA -- for me blow drier removal eliminates the need for that step. Interesting? http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/8835 ... -sheet.pdf |
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| Author: | Woodie G [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 2:49 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
In my line of work, there is a very distinct difference between a cut and a tear, but perhaps not so much in luthierie? |
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| Author: | AndyB [ Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Binding tape |
kencierp wrote: I only pre-seal if using CA -- for me blow drier removal eliminates the need for that step. I seal the top universally just as a matter of protecting it throughout the lifecycle of it being built. I figure a minute to wipe couple coats on is smart insurance. It has served me well. Andy |
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