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Almost All Shell Fingerboard
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Author:  Pat Hawley [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 9:27 am ]
Post subject:  Almost All Shell Fingerboard
I've got a client I've mentioned in previous posts that wants an acoustic bass guitar. Originally she wanted it powder blue in colour but has since relented. She still wants it in an all light wood including the bindings, arm rest and fingerboard (it's going to be fret-less). So it's going to be all maple with a sitka spruce top. I tried to talk her into a darker colour wood for the fingerboard, explaining that maple will get dirty looking very quickly. She gets that but has now come up with the idea of covering most of the fingerboard in shell. For example she has suggested getting two sets of the split block bass guitar inlay set from Andy DePaule and using these to minimize the amount of exposed maple on the fingerboard. She's quite serious about this. She's also willing to get custom work done.

Is there any reason a fingerboard should not be totally covered in shell? I'm also quite open to any ideas that people might have on how one might do this tastefully. The only limitations I can think of are those caused by having thin, flat shell going on a rounded fingerboard, i.e. I don't think having a single piece of shell span the whole fingerboard would work.

Thanks,
Pat
Author:  Chris Pile [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 10:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Well, I'm thinking it would sound different from an all wood fingerboard. Also, would it be more slick than wood - you know, maybe the strings would move a lot during vibrato? When I've played my fretless Jazz the strings kind of bite into the wood. Would it do that on shell? Hard to know.
Author:  DennisK [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Sounds like a fun project :) The only thing I'd worry about is making sure the fret barbs still have good material to grip. That, and refretting.

As for the artistic side, I'd probably do fat swirly patterns in white MOP, with pink or red abalone flowers at the marker frets. Whatever it is should be one continuous image, not just block inlays on every fret.

Alternatively, I wonder if just soaking a maple fingerboard with thin CA would penetrate and harden the surface enough to keep it looking clean for a long time?

Also FWIW, I'd use engelmann for the top since sitka darkens more. Holly binding with walnut side purfling, and turquoise recon stone bordered by walnut for the soundboard purf :) Actually, that binding/purfling would look great on the fingerboard too, assuming maple neck. No black anywhere on the whole instrument, unless requested by the client. (sorry, I've been designing guitars these past few days and just can't help myself)
Author:  Michael.N. [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Tortoise shell covered fretboards were found in centuries past, done as a thin veneer. I think they sometimes placed gold leaf underneath to illuminate it. Sometimes it was done on fretboards with quite a severe camber, as in some of the Cittern/English Guittars that are found. Tortoise shell may be easier to form than pearl though.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Since it's going to be fret-less I wonder if string noise would be an issue. i.e. a clicking noise from fretting on the shell?
Author:  dzsmith [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
It would look gaudy.
Author:  James Orr [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 12:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Dennis, I like the way you think.
Author:  Pat Hawley [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 12:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Thanks for your replies so far. I've thought about the shell being more slick than wood and perhaps being noisy but have no experience to back up my concerns. With respect to the design, I was thinking of covering the fingerboard in shell but having it bound in maple. I'm hoping the binding will sort of frame the shell and make it less gaudy (which I know it still will be). The bindings are going to be maple that has been off-cut from the sides, i.e. what Hesh used to call "stealth" bindings. I did compare sitka and Englemann tops and found that the sitka matched the wetted maple better than the Englemann.

Pat
Author:  Pat Hawley [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 12:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
I should have added that there will be no side purfling but the top will have blue paua abalone zipflex. I'm curious, Dennis, about your suggestion for having turquoise recon. stone for purfling. I'm not familiar with that. Can you point me to an example of what it looks like?

Pat
Author:  DennisK [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Pat Hawley wrote:
I should have added that there will be no side purfling but the top will have blue paua abalone zipflex. I'm curious, Dennis, about your suggestion for having turquoise recon. stone for purfling. I'm not familiar with that. Can you point me to an example of what it looks like?

Pat

Maple to maple seam with no side purfling? I'll have to see that one before I'm convinced it's a good idea...

I've never seen an actual guitar with turquoise purfling, but this is what gave me the idea http://www.rescuepearl.com/recon-rose.htm

Also, I somehow managed to miss the bit about this being fretless. Probably will feel different to some extent than an all wood board, but perhaps in a good way. Coating the maple with thin CA still seems like a good idea. Steve's concern of string noise is worthy of consideration. Both clicking when pressing strings down, or rattling against shell (mainly if the client prefers very low action). Probably not a problem, but depends on the player... sort of like how the clicking of long nails against piano keys bothers some people but not others.

Also probably don't need the flower fret markers for fretless... though they wouldn't hurt either, and having more than one kind of shell would look nicer. It may be gaudy, but it can also be beautiful if done well :) Avoid the "bling for the sake of bling" look.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Perhaps the majority of the shell could be a backdrop for a feature somewhat like an ebony fretboard is the backdrop for a vine inlay idunno
Author:  dzsmith [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
SteveSmith wrote:
Perhaps the majority of the shell could be a backdrop for a feature somewhat like an ebony fretboard is the backdrop for a vine inlay idunno

Now that's a cool idea!
Author:  J De Rocher [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 5:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Pat Hawley wrote:
I should have added that there will be no side purfling but the top will have blue paua abalone zipflex. I'm curious, Dennis, about your suggestion for having turquoise recon. stone for purfling. I'm not familiar with that. Can you point me to an example of what it looks like?

Pat


Here's an example. It came in strips about 4 or 5 inches long in the width you see in the photo. The strips were straight but could be shaped into curves using a heat gun.

Image
Author:  murrmac [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 5:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
You could check out Grit Laskin's work http://williamlaskin.com/gallery/.

He has been making shell covered fretboards for ever.
Author:  James Orr [ Fri Jun 05, 2015 6:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
I'm wondering if you'd be able to adjust relief?
Author:  Clay S. [ Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Some older guitars had MOTS covered fingerboards. You could do a faux MOTS board with ablam and flush wood strips to act as fret markers while still keeping it fretless.
Author:  Frank Ford [ Sat Jun 06, 2015 8:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Solid MOP fingerboards have been used frequently in the past, and they are in the nightmare category for refret work among other obvious problems.

If you want a light color "natural wood" board, check out Gallery Hardwoods They offer "stabilized" wood fingerboards that are fully impregnated so there's no absorption of oil, dirt or other discoloring agent.
Author:  Pat Hawley [ Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
The idea occurred to me today that perhaps what I should do is just put in shell strips where the frets would be if it had frets, i.e. in the place where the strings will be (or should be) pressed against the board. Perhaps if they were wide enough, the rest of the board would stay relatively clean. Also thanks for the idea of the stabilized wood, Frank. I'll look into that as well.

Pat
Author:  Frank Ford [ Sat Jun 06, 2015 3:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Hope it doesn't come off as patronizing, but I have a suggestion:

As you work with your client, be sure not to get pressed into agreeing to do something with which you are not comfortable. If you do, there's a high probability that one or both of you will end up disappointed. Anyone can hear "no" if it is presented appropriately. . .
Author:  Pat Hawley [ Sat Jun 06, 2015 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
I hear you Frank. With this client I've found myself straddling the line a few times. On one hand I'm thinking this could be a very different project and therefore a learning experience on the other hand I've been very close to sending back her deposit...
Pat
Author:  Jeff Highland [ Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
I did some setup and repair work on a factory fretless acoustic bass with a lot of shell inlay. There were problems with evenness of the surface and some of the inlays had hollow patches underneath which affected the sound. I ended up having to flood a lot of areas with CA, which helped, but left me convinced to never put inlay on a fretless board.
Author:  routleyc [ Sun Jun 07, 2015 12:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
J De Rocher wrote:
Pat Hawley wrote:
I should have added that there will be no side purfling but the top will have blue paua abalone zipflex. I'm curious, Dennis, about your suggestion for having turquoise recon. stone for purfling. I'm not familiar with that. Can you point me to an example of what it looks like?

Pat


Here's an example. It came in strips about 4 or 5 inches long in the width you see in the photo. The strips were straight but could be shaped into curves using a heat gun.

Image


Dennis I love that look! I'm prepping to build a Claro Walnut and Western Red Cedar top OM guitar with curly maple binding and rosewood fingerboard and bridge with a mahagony neck laminated with Mah/Curly Maple/Claro Walnut/Curly Maple/Mah pattern. They inlay theme is Paua Abalone I don't want to use that same thing around the top for purfling but that Turquoise recon looks great. Where did you get that from? Also open to any suggestions on the design.
Author:  Goat Rock Ukulele [ Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Man oh man. What are you going to do if you get that thing all covered with shell and she decides the strings kind of slip when fingering. I would made sure you are going to get paid either way. I don't like the idea at all.
Author:  Greg B [ Mon Jun 08, 2015 10:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Almost All Shell Fingerboard
Yeah, I have to say this idea sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. I'd only try it on a guitar for myself, but not a commission.

The stabilized wood is a great idea. Didn't your client want light colored wood anyway? You could do birdseye maple or something like that, and get the flash of shell without the trouble. Since it's impregnated with acrylic, it won't get dirty, yet it could still be sanded and shaped for perfect action. Plus it comes in light blue. :D
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