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MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=41917		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  ZekeM [ Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
I've wondered about the same thing. Could make sharpening pretty painless as there would be no leveling of stones involved.

I'll be curious to see any responses.
Author:  Colin North [ Tue Nov 12, 2013 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
FWIW, I'm all diamond stones and I've been using the DMT 8000 for a couple of years now.
Wouldn't trade it for a full set of waterstones because of the convenience.
It takes a bit of breaking in, as it says in the blurb with it. I gave it a good rub with a 316 SS block when I first got mine,
Bevels showed obvious scratches initially, gradually lessening as time goes on. (I can still see them with mine)
I go to 1200 (Eze Lap SF) for primary bevels, then the 8000 for the secondaries.
Cuts A2 steel effortlessly, 6/8 strokes plenty for a secondary bevel.
You'll probably get a better polish with the Norton, but I can plane with 1 thou. or less shavings as it is, so I'm delighted.
Author:  Goodin [ Tue Nov 12, 2013 9:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
Filippo I've been considering the same thing. I go up to 1200 (fine I think?) on the DMT stones then use a leather strop with aluminum oxide to finish. Wondering what an 8000 grit diamond stone would do. Colin about has me convinced;)
Author:  ernie [ Tue Nov 12, 2013 9:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
I use a 10000 grit chinese blue soft stone that woodcraft was peddling abt 5 yrs ago. Seems to work well after using a 20 yr.old 8000 stone. But I really like the 600 and now 1200 grit diamond stones for the initial secondary bevel, then move up to higher grits.
Author:  Colin North [ Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
Filippo Morelli wrote:
Colin, good to hear you have a positive experience - and one built over time as well. That's encouraging. Curious, any other folks? So Colin a 1200 and 8000 DMT and you are good to go? Any trade-offs you'd mention? I do the 1200 DMT currently then move to Norton 4000/8000 (of which I use the 8000). I have the Norton 220/1000, 4000/8000 and leveling stone.

Filippo

I'll be interested to see what others say myself.
I actually use an Eze-Lap 400/1200 with the DMT 8000. Don't seem to need anything in between. (I also have a large Faithfull 300 to "save" the others for damaged blades)
Trade-offs? Not really. Difficult to say, I've never really used anything else in earnest.
Author:  Trevor Gore [ Tue Nov 12, 2013 11:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
I've used the DMT blue (325) and green (1200) for ~10 years now, as a two stone pair with low odour kero as the lube. I tried finishing on a 8000 water stone for a while, but the extra performance (minimal) wasn't worth the extra effort with water stones. I can get good life and see-through shavings on all the different steel alloys I use finishing on the 1200 (no stropping).
Author:  Colin North [ Wed Nov 13, 2013 9:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
Forgot to mention, I have started to use this for sharpening lubricant.
Author:  ZekeM [ Wed Nov 13, 2013 9:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
Use what Colin??
Author:  Colin North [ Wed Nov 13, 2013 9:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
What happened there?
This http://www.rockler.com/honerite-gold-water-stone-additive
No rush to clean diamond stones after use to prevent rust.
Author:  Michael.N. [ Wed Nov 13, 2013 9:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
Well I guess that the advantage of the DMT over the waterstone is it staying flat. I don't flatten my waterstone very much at all, so for me I doubt that the DMT will offer anything. . . . but there's always the curiosity that seems to follow sharpening matters.
Author:  Beth Mayer [ Wed Nov 13, 2013 10:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
Can you just use ordinary honing oil with the DTMs? Sorry, just read the blurb on the EEF and it says soapy water. Although a light oil would be more convenient for me to use in my non-plumbed shop
Author:  Colin North [ Wed Nov 13, 2013 12:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
Beth Mayer wrote:
Can you just use ordinary honing oil with the DTMs? Sorry, just read the blurb on the EEF and it says soapy water. Although a light oil would be more convenient for me to use in my non-plumbed shop


Mine's non-plumbed too. Proverbial pain, but I've got used to taking down supplies when I need them (most of the time!).
One of the reasons the Honerite is useful as I said is the stones can sit for hours without the metal particles going rusty, which can happen real quickly without it, and is a mess to clean.
Anyway, Trevor seems to have been using low odour kerosene for many years on diamond stones with no ill effects, that's a petroleum product.
Author:  Trevor Gore [ Wed Nov 13, 2013 5:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MDT extra extra fine for edge tools?
The choice of cutting fluid is an important one. The fluid forms a film between the blade and the "stone" and the thickness of that film determines the depth of the grooves that the abrasive makes in the tool being sharpened. The film thickness is controlled by honing speed, load applied and the viscosity of the lubricant (plus a few other more esoteric variables). What works for my technique is a low viscosity liquid, but of sufficient viscosity that as I taper down the loading, the film thickness increases and the depth of cut reduces, so emulating the effects of using a finer grade "stone". For me, water is a little low in viscosity and has the major disadvantage of rusting out everything it touches, including the bearings on honing guides etc.. The low odour kero is inexpensive, doesn't stink as much as ordinary kero, has the right viscosity for me (a lot lubes are too viscous for my liking) and evaporates to dry without causing rust. And it washes out the honing debris effectively, too.

I spent years trying all sorts of things until I settled on the simple method I use now: two stones, low odour kero and a decent honing guide to suit the blades being sharpened. And the bit that few texts talk about, learning to taper the loading effectively.
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