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| A little about nut slotting http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=39429 |
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| Author: | pmgnut [ Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | A little about nut slotting |
Hello all, I have been whittling away at some bone blanks lately and am just wanting to know about the correct way to begin cutting the nut slots. Do the slots get cut straight { from the neck side} for a portion of the way, then take a slight downward angle and finally another slight angle toward each tuning peg?? OR....do they get cut straight all the way through, with the exception of a slight downward angle only? |
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| Author: | Chuck Gilbert [ Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
I'm sure there are several opinions, but I cut a straight downward slope from the neck (leading) edge of the nut and I don't worry so much about a lateral angle toward each tuner. If the slot is the correct size for the string and is smooth, the strings will slide easily. You want to make sure that the string registers from the exact leading edge of the nut for proper tuning. Good luck, Chuck |
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| Author: | pmgnut [ Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
Do the slots get cut with the same exact fle size as the string gauge? Example, if I am slotting the e string, and my string gauge is .010, do I use the same size nut slotting file of .010, or go slightly larger? |
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| Author: | jfmckenna [ Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
I like the look of angling the slot to point at the tuning peg posts. But I won't claim it makes it tune any better, just looks good. I also would suggest you make the slot a bit wider than the string gauge. The string will find the lowest point to rest in the U-shaped channel and won't get caught up on the sides. I also like to expose about half the string height (thickness) on the low-E string out of the slot and on down to the the high-E and B strings which are sunk in to full height, flush to the top of the slot. You just want enough bone there to hold the string in place. |
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| Author: | pmgnut [ Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
Ok, that helps. They seem very easy to cut and shape but slotting seems to take some know how and practice. I just made one for one of my guitars but the b string is buzzing, probably because I cut the slot way too deep. Now to try and make a custom pre-filter for the belt sanding machine. I feel like I'm at the dentist's office! |
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| Author: | dzsmith [ Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
I bought a few nut files from Stewmac recently. Man, what a time saver these things are. Question: how do you start the slots? Is it best to saw with a thin-kerf blade before using the nut files? I need a way to start the slots exactly where I want them to be. Dan |
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| Author: | GregG [ Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
One way to start the slots is to use your smallest file to set the spot, then the larger/proper size will follow perfectly. |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:25 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
If the string sounds weird open and it's still not too low, then you need to angle the cut a little bit to get correct bearing surface. That usually fixes most issue. I use 4 nut files, because it doesn't matter so much if the slot is slightly larger, in fact it is preferred to prevent binding but the bottom should either be square or round (not V shaped), and the slot is cut at a slight downward angle to the headstock so you don't get the sitar-y sound. |
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| Author: | nyazzip [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
Quote: Question: how do you start the slots? i use a very small triangular file to start; cut deeper(hence wider) for larger strings |
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| Author: | John Coloccia [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 6:00 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
dzsmith wrote: I bought a few nut files from Stewmac recently. Man, what a time saver these things are. Question: how do you start the slots? Is it best to saw with a thin-kerf blade before using the nut files? I need a way to start the slots exactly where I want them to be. Dan I JUST bought StewMac's double sided nut files. These things ROCK. I like them so much better than the regular, straight nut files (though I still use those too). The sizes run a little funny, but they're close enough. To start the slots, I use a razor saw. I don't go deep...just a swipe or two to give the file something to latch on to. For the wider slots, you need to work your way up to the correct file size. So I may make an initial swipe with a .017", and then maybe a .026" and a .052", or something like that. |
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| Author: | Dave Stewart [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
As a "starter" file, as well as high e, I use this (3" full cut) http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.a ... 3072,43089 It is incredibly sharp edged for a file, has lots of uses. |
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| Author: | John Coloccia [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
Dave Stewart wrote: As a "starter" file, as well as high e, I use this (3" full cut) http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.a ... 3072,43089 It is incredibly sharp edged for a file, has lots of uses. I have one of those too, specifically for starting nut slots in fact. The only reason I got away from it is that the diamond shape made it difficult for me to see the line I was cutting on, and I found I always had to tweak the position left or right after the initial cut. I DO use that particular file to widen the initial saw kerf I make sometimes, though. |
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| Author: | pmgnut [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
Here is a picture of the stock nut I am replacing. It's one of these funky L shaped nuts. I don't see any reason to try and copy this shape exact { carving out the L channel shape } so I'm thinking to just shape a standard bone nut for this. |
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| Author: | John Coloccia [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
I've never seen a nut like that. Where did it come from? |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
There are worse... like integrated saddle found on cheaper guitars, and you can't just put a straight saddle in it because it would break the pickup. Those saddles are often made of cheap plastic that can't handle string pressure. |
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| Author: | LuthierSupplier [ Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | A little about nut slotting |
dzsmith wrote: Question: how do you start the slots? Is it best to saw with a thin-kerf blade before using the nut files? I need a way to start the slots exactly where I want them to be. Dan Dan I use a jeweler a saw |
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| Author: | pmgnut [ Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
That nut came off of an Ibanez acoustic. Not sure exactly what it's made of, not plastic though, has kind of a chanky sound when dropped. |
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| Author: | dzsmith [ Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
LuthierSupplier wrote: dzsmith wrote: Question: how do you start the slots? Is it best to saw with a thin-kerf blade before using the nut files? I need a way to start the slots exactly where I want them to be. Dan Dan I use a jeweler a saw Thanks Tracy, I have several jeweler's saws with thin kerfs. I sometimes forget I have certain tools: I hid these from my kids. 'Sounds like a good way to go. Dan |
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| Author: | bluescreek [ Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
The nut slot is often one of the least thought of , yet most important parts in the feel and playability of the guitar. The nut slot should actually have a curve to it. Steel strings do not bend at a given point. They tend to arc so you want to use that information when doing the nut slot. I want the slot to be gentle and if you think roller that may help. I used a lot of different nut files and now only use the decimal sized files. I like to use the same size of the string and just a slight angle of the file will open the slot all you need. Also do a bugle or funnel end on the back of the nut for some lead in. More often the string hands there and POPS . I also set the nut up so I am about .007 off the top of the plane of the first 2 frets. You need the string to be on solid contact coming off the nut , if there is any gap you can have a zitarish but and intonation issues. Then if you want to compensate the nut you would want to trim a bit off the fretboard so you can shorten the nut slot to get to the point of best intonation. Learning to make a proper nut is important for playability , feel and intonation. |
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| Author: | Tom West [ Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
String spacing can be a problem also when filing nuts. Two basic ways to space. Equally spaced centers or equally spaced strings. I prefer the latter and do it by measurement with dial calipers. Set the two e strings at the required location,just enough so they will stay in place. Measure the diameter of the a,d,g, and b strings and add them together. Subtract the total from the measured space between the two e strings. Divide the answer by 5 and you have the amount of spacing between each string in thousands of an inch. Position either the a or b string till it measures correctly,then take a sharp pencil and mark the nut on either side of the string. Move string and file in the center of marks to set string lightly. Proceed across the rest of the strings. Reset all strings and remeasure,then make any required correction before setting strings to depth. Follow previous posts for the finishing of the slots. Tom |
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| Author: | dzsmith [ Sat Feb 23, 2013 10:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
Tom West wrote: String spacing can be a problem also when filing nuts. Two basic ways to space. Equally spaced centers or equally spaced strings. I prefer the latter and do it by measurement with dial calipers. Set the two e strings at the required location,just enough so they will stay in place. Measure the diameter of the a,d,g, and b strings and add them together. Subtract the total from the measured space between the two e strings. Divide the answer by 5 and you have the amount of spacing between each string in thousands of an inch. Position either the a or b string till it measures correctly,then take a sharp pencil and mark the nut on either side of the string. Move string and file in the center of marks to set string lightly. Proceed across the rest of the strings. Reset all strings and remeasure,then make any required correction before setting strings to depth. Follow previous posts for the finishing of the slots. Tom Thanks for this info Tom! I've been reluctant to purchse a nut spacing scale. I will try this spacing method. Dan |
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| Author: | Tai Fu [ Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
dzsmith wrote: Tom West wrote: String spacing can be a problem also when filing nuts. Two basic ways to space. Equally spaced centers or equally spaced strings. I prefer the latter and do it by measurement with dial calipers. Set the two e strings at the required location,just enough so they will stay in place. Measure the diameter of the a,d,g, and b strings and add them together. Subtract the total from the measured space between the two e strings. Divide the answer by 5 and you have the amount of spacing between each string in thousands of an inch. Position either the a or b string till it measures correctly,then take a sharp pencil and mark the nut on either side of the string. Move string and file in the center of marks to set string lightly. Proceed across the rest of the strings. Reset all strings and remeasure,then make any required correction before setting strings to depth. Follow previous posts for the finishing of the slots. Tom Thanks for this info Tom! I've been reluctant to purchse a nut spacing scale. I will try this spacing method. Dan Get the scale, it will make the job 10 times easier |
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| Author: | Fred Tellier [ Sat Feb 23, 2013 12:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
I cut my slots close to depth with a zona saw then finish with the proper files for each string gauge. If the StewMac nut spacing rule is too expensive luthiers cool tools has a laminated paper one created with autocad that will do the job for $8.00. I have an earlier version of this and the Stewmac rule and the Luthier cool tools one is much faster, easier to use and just as accurate. Fred |
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| Author: | dradlin [ Sat Feb 23, 2013 1:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Re: A little about nut slotting |
pmgnut wrote: Do the slots get cut straight { from the neck side} for a portion of the way, then take a slight downward angle and finally another slight angle toward each tuning peg?? OR....do they get cut straight all the way through, with the exception of a slight downward angle only? I want the jog/bend in the string (as it runs to the post) to happen on the dead side of the nut, so I cut the slot as a continuation of the string straight through the nut. If the jog/bend in the string affects the string vibration I don't want it to affect the business side of the string. |
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| Author: | Dave Stewart [ Sat Feb 23, 2013 2:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A little about nut slotting |
Fred Tellier wrote: If the StewMac nut spacing rule is too expensive luthiers cool tools has a laminated paper one created with autocad that will do the job for $8.00. I can beat that! I use Steve Senseneys PDF progressive spacing templates avail free at MIMF ..... print one on cardstock for each guitar & keep in the file. (Based on actual e-E spacing, you just mark & cut the card on diagonal to get the rest of the spaces.) http://www.mimf.com/old-lib/progressive_nut_scale.pdf |
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