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large wire nuts
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=36007		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Tai Fu [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:09 am ]
Post subject:  large wire nuts
I need some help here...

I need some large wire nuts to join some largish wires, a 6 gauge, a 8 gauge, and another 12 gauge wires together. I was looking for some red wire nuts but I can't find it... in fact I have difficulty finding wire nuts at all because few people in Taiwan use them like they're supposed to.

I need it for air conditioner circuits and currently they're simply twisted on and electrical taped over... I had to solder one when I discovered that the wire nut I can find is too small for them.

I need those big winged wire nuts, preferably an assortment of them. Funny thing is they're made in Taiwan yet no one uses them.
Author:  Jmc2010 [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Tai, technically speaking a soldered wire joint is better. It's conductivity should be better, and there is really no chance of it coming apart if soldered correctly. If it were me, and I couldn't find wire nuts, I would solder my joints and use shrink tube or electrical tape to isolate and insulate them.
Author:  Tai Fu [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Jmc2010 wrote:
Tai, technically speaking a soldered wire joint is better. It's conductivity should be better, and there is really no chance of it coming apart if soldered correctly. If it were me, and I couldn't find wire nuts, I would solder my joints and use shrink tube or electrical tape to isolate and insulate them.


I never thought anyone would solder house/shop circuits... I guess its because it's too time consuming.

I was more concerned with poor joints causing a fire and not to mention electrical tape falling off and causing a short.
Author:  Jmc2010 [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Tai Fu wrote:

I never thought anyone would solder house/shop circuits... I guess its because it's too time consuming.

I was more concerned with poor joints causing a fire and not to mention electrical tape falling off and causing a short.


A soldered joint won't come apart as long as you are using a flux based solder, or you have flux to put on the wire before you solder it. If you have access to shrink tubing, it is as good as the insulation used on the wire originally IMHO. It may not be as thick, but it is a good insulator, and isn't going to come off. You just need to make sure the tube is on the wire before the joint is made, then slide it over the joint, add heat, and viola. Electrical tape isn't as good, but if it is clean, and stretched while applied, it usually won't come off without some sort of effort.
Author:  Colin North [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Can't help on the wire things, they were outlawed here years ago as unsafe.
But. do you get this type of thing (connector blocks) in Taiwan?? Basically a series of small brass blocks, hole drilled though it, with screws each end, encased in plastic.
They are very handy, cheap, insulated (although I usually cover them with tape anyway) and you just cut off as many as you need.
I've used them quite a bit, in various sizes.
Author:  Daniel Minard [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 10:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Since my sister almost lost her house to an electrical fire caused by a loose wire nut, I solder connections as a matter of course. It doesn't take much time & is a much better connection that won't degrade over time. You don't need to use heat shrink. Under electrical code (in my area, at least) electrical tape is recommended.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
I am not an electrician but here is how I was taught to do wire nuts by an electrician: Twist the wires together tight using electrician pliers, trim them to length, and then put the nut on finger tight followed by a twist with the pliers to lock it down good. Electrically, the circuit should be just fine even if the nut is not on it because of the mechanical connection caused by twisting the wires together. Unfortunately it is easy to misuse wire nuts. I have seen some pretty screwed up wiring when doing remodels and such.
Author:  Alex Kleon [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
The best wire nuts are the two piece ones that have a set-screw to gang the wires together with an outer cover.
Attachment:
wire nut.jpg


Alex
Author:  klooker [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Tai,

I think one of the key things to do if soldering, is first twist the wires together using electrician (or lineman's) pliers as Steve said for installing wire nuts.

The lineman's pliers will achieve a good tight twist so you'll have good contact between the wires before soldering.

Kevin Looker
Author:  John Coloccia [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
If you think we argue about things here, mention wire nuts on an electrician's forum and you'll really see an argument. Twist vs don't twist is an active debate :)
Author:  wbergman [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
When the member is UK noted they are illegal in UK, I thought that might be why you cannot find them near you. I had a similar problem years ago. I had to drive to the neighboring city to get the type of electical part that I was used to using. When the inspector came to approve the work, he made me take it out and start over, because my city did not allow that kind of part. So follow the advice of the others and do a better job than wire nuts.











so, follow the advice of the others and do a better job that wire nuts.
Author:  Colin North [ Wed Apr 04, 2012 4:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Colin North wrote:
Can't help on the wire things, they were outlawed here years ago as unsafe.
But. do you get this type of thing (connector blocks) in Taiwan?? Basically a series of small brass blocks, hole drilled though it, with screws each end, encased in plastic.
They are very handy, cheap, insulated (although I usually cover them with tape anyway) and you just cut off as many as you need.
I've used them quite a bit, in various sizes.

I'd be please to mail you some in various sizes if you PM me with address, I've plenty spare kicking about.
If you can wait for the airmail that is - could post today.
Author:  sanaka [ Sun Apr 08, 2012 2:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
6 and 8 awg is getting too big for wire nuts imo. Even though they make them for these gauges, this size of wire doesn't like to twist together, which is essential for a good wire nut splice. Wire nuts are perfectly fine for 10 gauge and smaller where hand strength can cause the wires to twist tightly together and the threads of the wire nut bite into the copper keeping everything locked in place. Even then, if there's several 12's or 10's in the splice, it's good to use a tool to twist the wire nut. I have a ratcheting screwdriver with a tapered cavity on the back end of the handle that wedges over a wire nut letting you turn it with the screwdriver handle - if you're doing lots of splices it saves your wrist too.

There are many splicing devices for larger wire, split bolts being the most common because they're cheap and effective. A properly soldered joint is definitely the best electrically. This is hardly done anymore though: the various splicing devices were invented to be faster and easier than soldering.

The picture that Colin North posted is a terminal block. They're great but they connect wires 1 to 1, as opposed to 'bussing' them in a typical splice. To use them as a splice connection, you have to jumper the individual connectors together: easier to use a purpose designed device.
Author:  alan stassforth [ Sun Apr 08, 2012 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
Yes, Rob.
Split nuts for big wires,
and wrap many time around with electrical tape.
Author:  Bryan Bear [ Mon Apr 09, 2012 12:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: large wire nuts
alan stassforth wrote:
Yes, Rob.
Split nuts for big wires,
and wrap many time around with electrical tape.


And if you make the first few wraps with the tape sticky side out then a half twist and tape the rest, the next repairman only needs a quick knife cut.
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