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flat vs. domed tops
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=36005		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Jim Watts [ Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:19 pm ]
Post subject:  flat vs. domed tops
I'm curious to hear opinions and reasons for choosing to build with a flat top vs. a domed top. I've always built with a dome but have been pondering a flat build (well not quite), just to see for myself. I'm hoping for more of a discussion on tone, response, dynaminc range etc... than one on pure structure and humidity changes. I'm pretty sure there a few here that are building flat.
Thanks
Author:  bluescreek [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: flat vs. domed tops
there will be differences in the applied forces. The only way to be sure is for you yourself build 2 guitars as identical as possible , do one flat and one domed. I know that I went away from the flat tops and use a dome . A question like this is often subjective and it comes down to what a preference would be so decide for yourself
Author:  jfmckenna [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: flat vs. domed tops
This topic has great interest to me as well. The first guitar I built back in 1992 was based off of Sloans book and was a true flat top. I always liked the guitar but of course being my first and having zero wood working skills it's not really a factor. After that I read about how quality guitars had domed tops for strength and resistance to humidity changes and that they were superior and more difficult to make ect... So I fell into that over the next 20 years. The last guitar I built was a true flat top because like you I wanted to see what it's all about. It really truly is a great sounding guitar and I think I will build the next few that are not under commission like that. I don't really know how to describe the tonal difference and I really cannot chalk it up to being a flat top or just voodoo but I really really like the way this guitar sounds.

Intuitively it seems to make sense that not stressing the top will give it greater freedom of movement but that's all intuition is worth.
Author:  David Newton [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: flat vs. domed tops
Speaking in broad generalities, the greater the arch the stiffer the top.
Tops are fun to experiment with, that is why you should always be building a guitar for yourself.
I used to do all my tops with a 25' r. and now have (pretty much) settled on a 45' r.
Depending on the particular guitar, I may make the top below the X flat, and radius the top above the X.
Tone wise? They all have great tone, why wouldn't they?
They will differ slightly in one or another aspect of tone. If you have built enough guitars to have worked out a understanding of how to make great tone, little things like radius are just another tool in your box.
Author:  Mike Collins [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: flat vs. domed tops
You've gotten some great replys.
I find I like the tone of a domed top better.
Plus ya can fool with the edges of the top to make a screamer!
Also because of the dome you can use more flexible braces!

I have made both -I like the dome.
Do like John says-make 2 sister guitars
Mike
Author:  Kent Chasson [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: flat vs. domed tops
IME, more doming favors more articulation and a more forward, strident sound.

Flatter favors warmth and low end rumble.

As I'm sure you know, doming is just part of the equation. For instance, it's possible to get low end rumble with a pronounced dome but the way I see it, you kind of have to fight the natural tendency.
Author:  timn [ Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: flat vs. domed tops
I just finished a 000 and an OM -one 24.9 and the OM 25.4. Both were arched to 25' forward of the bridge and flat behind. I did a serious heat treatment to the top the day before bracing the shorter scale and normal heating for HHG on the OM. The arch on the OOO is nearly 2X that on the OM at 1/8" high at each edge for a total of 1/4' arch while the OM is a total of just over 1/8. I attempted to carve the braces to be identical so I attribute the greater arch to the heat treatment. 150 degrees for 30 minutes with 2 heat lamps and 120 degrees just before bracing. The 000 is very nice Sitka and the OM red spruce- the difference in tone is dramatic with the OOO with significant arch sounding like a Larson (built under tension) with fast attack, strong trebles and mids and tight bass and loud and penetrating - almost like an arch top. The OM is remarkably more complex and sweet yet still with a fast attack and great balance high to low. The OM has that wonderful smooth inspirational tone in single notes and bending while the OOO is quick and piercing almost like a Selmer. Both good but significantly different guitars for completely different uses. While I'm an amateur having completed 7 instruments and moving into learning about tuning plates and sound analysis (I built them based on vintage Martin specs - 38 OOO and 33 OM) -I am also truly amazed at the differences and can only conclude it mostly relates to the top arching/bracing. The woods likely contribute but based on things I've read and heard, I think the arch is a main contributing factor. So much to learn!
Tim
Author:  woody b [ Wed Apr 04, 2012 5:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: flat vs. domed tops
Kent Chasson wrote:
IME, more doming favors more articulation and a more forward, strident sound.

Flatter favors warmth and low end rumble.

As I'm sure you know, doming is just part of the equation. For instance, it's possible to get low end rumble with a pronounced dome but the way I see it, you kind of have to fight the natural tendency.



That's the way it works for me. I use flat tops on 000/OM or smaller guitars, and domed tops on dreads and jumbos. IME humidity control is really important when building, but it's really really really important when building a flat top.
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