Official Luthiers Forum!

Anyone have details on this new finish they are offering on their Collector's Series guitars?

I remember Michael Dresdner telling me years ago about saving cigar ashes to do really fine finishes on furniture.... I don't think he mixed it with anything. Just a slightly greasy palm and ashes scattered along as he worked to put the final shine on the piece.

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"Act your age, not your shoe size" - Prince

Put's a whole new meaning to "Tobacco burst"

The other thing I can think of is that Carbon Black (AKA Lamp Black) makes the most beautiful, black finish.... It's a super duper pure black finish that never fades.... and it was historically gotten from lamp soot...

Thanks

My personal favorite was the "Dog hair" finish by one of the larger acoustic manufacturers...

I sat there thinking to myself - What's the big deal? I get dog hair in every guitar I make and I don't even charge extra....

Thanks

For some reason,
and maybe somebody can tell me why,
I keep getting white dog hairs in me finishes?
Oh, if ya need ashes,
I could send ya some!
Postage would be pretty cheap.

Padma! We've missed you buddy!

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Old growth, shmold growth!

So it's as simple as taking the soot and rubbing it straight onto the wood? Simple enough, I gotta try it. I hope oil varnish over the top of it won't hurt anything.

I found out PRS calls it "London Soot" Ha!

Ummmm... I don't think it's put on the raw wood.... I could have gotten the wrong idea, too.
Dresdner used it to polish the finish, not the wood.
Mebbe you ought to talk to someone at PRS?

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"Act your age, not your shoe size" - Prince

I could see the logic of rubbing ashes, then sandback "to the white" (which should leave the grain slightly enhanced), then sealing & finishing. Might have to try that.

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Dave
Milton, ON

It's only genuine "London Soot" if it was collected by a Victorian child stuffed up a London chimney - I believe that it's CITES listed now

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Dave White
De Faoite Stringed Instruments
". . . the one thing a machine just can't do is give you character and personalities and sometimes that comes with flaws, but it always comes with humanity" Monty Don talking about hand weaving, "Mastercrafts", Weaving, BBC March 2010

Doesn't the resident have to be burning a dalbergia of some sort in their fireplace in order for CITIES to apply?

I'm pretty sure I know what it is (as I've seen him do some finishes with a material that could be called "sooty")...but if Paul isn't telling you then I'm not gonna either (out of respect for him)

Never doubt that Paul is the best person in the world to market a guitar. I was blown away by his insight into marketing when I worked there and I still am. He knows what the customers value and how to deliver that value to them. Not all aspects of a product are tangible...

Trev

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http://www.PeakeGuitars.com

How about a picture for reference?

As I suspect the soot thing has FAR more to do with marketing than lutherie, he will probably get more respect on the marketing forums than here.

It's rare to get a chuckle here. Thank you sir.

No offense but it's actually quite traditional. Just cuz he knows how to sell stuff, doesn't mean he doesn't know what he's talking about...

As an aside, one of the things that impressed me a lot is that every Christmas he dresses up like Santa and has the fire department ride him up to the factory where he gives presents to everyone's kids. He LOVES it...!

Trev

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http://www.PeakeGuitars.com

I'm with Charlie. For a minute or 2 I thought about a "soot" finish by smoking a cigar while I was spraying the finish, but.......I thought of several reasons not to try it.

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I didn't mean to say it, but I meant what I said.
http://www.brackettinstruments.com/

No offense taken, Trev...and none intended for my part.

Hmmmm...a Havana soot finish? I wonder if the tone of the guitar would be more robust than that of a Dominican or Honduran soot finished one.

OK, I'll admit it does look pretty cool...

Yep, they do OK...! (c:

Trev

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http://www.PeakeGuitars.com

I can replicate that finish in a short period of time....if I wanted to!

Actually I already have, but not on a guitar. I can lay out the process, but it is
going to cost somebody something!

Mike

Looks to me to be a sprayed, waterbase, black dye...sanded back, followed by a black dye sunburst, followed by a UV cure sytem with a tinge of black in the topcoat.

I have one finished I call "smoke" dye.....just a little black in the nitro topcoat. I don't do the dye and sandback or the sunburst, which creates the striking contrast...but the topcoat certainly looks like this.

I did bunch of test panels practicing sandbacks. This included one where I burned a bunch of paper and rubbed the soot into the raw board. You know....it actually worked pretty well but the result was a fairly light gray color...not even close to black in the highlighted areas. Don't see any reason to use soot or ashes when dyes are onhand. At the time of this test I didn't have any black.

After getting some black dye I found that northeastern figured maple, being harder, was a lot easier to achieve a good looking sandback with. I'll admit, however, that the test panels I had of western, big leaf maple were particularly soft and I don't believe they represented a typical, good piece of western maple. I'm still of the impression, after these tests, that the harder your figured lumber....the better the result of the sandback.

I think hardness results in less dye penetration with the parallel figure which means that wood will sand back whiter...resulting in better contrast. ....a theory. Please debunk if I'm wrong. If anyone disputes this I would certainly appreciate a brief description of their process using fairly soft figured maple. I put this experimenting away unitl things settle down for me but I'm definitely going to want to get this wired down as I progress.

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I read Emerson on the can. A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...true...but a consistent reading of Emerson has its uses nevertheless.

StuMusic

Stuart that dye and sand back and re dye is how I got my soot finish on rifle stocks and pistol grips. I did one set of highly figured blistered eastern hard maple and sanded it back. The contrast was stark, and looked like a snow leopard (sp) coat. I could have made a ton on money if I could have found a good supply of the wood. Too spotty on the supply side to advertize snow Leopard maple!

Have you attained perfection with the uv system?

Mike