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Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=32702		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  David Newton [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
I'm in no financial condition to be taking a flyer on fairly expensive wood to experiment and see if it will be a suitable alternative to traditional, exotic, fretboard wood.
So when John Arnold pointed out a man who had some Texas Ebony in log cants, I took leave of my senses and bit off a chunk.
When the shipper left it on the porch, my wife said "if you want it, you'll have to pick it up yourself, it's too heavy for me"
It will be a close stretch to get 3 or 4 board out of the log quarter, but I got 1, this morning. It mills like a dream, and is at least as hard as good rosewood.
The color is good, if you like green. Thus, the pics...

Image

Image
Author:  Steve Kinnaird [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
David, I've used it a couple of times with good results. It IS quite hard.
There are at least two species that go by the name "Texas Ebony", and my supplier must have access to both, as I've got some wood just like your picture, and some that is more mauve in color. Both excel at fingerboards/bridges, and if available in large enough pieces, should make fine back and top wood.

Congrats on your find!

Steve
Author:  mcgr40 [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Looks super to me, and having never had senses to leave, I would have borrowed to buy 2 cants. Wonder where in Texas that grows.
Author:  David Newton [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Quote:
and if available in large enough pieces, should make fine back and top wood.


Yeah, Steve, that should make some fine top wood... beehive

and...
Mission, near the Rio Grande.
Author:  Steve Kinnaird [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
David Newton wrote:
Quote:
and if available in large enough pieces, should make fine back and top wood.


Yeah, Steve, that should make some fine top wood... beehive



Hmmm.... don't do as I say, do as I do. (Ain't that right?)

Better to have said it only makes good tops for classicals.

Say--we're even now, aren't we? :lol:

Steve
Author:  Alex Kleon [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 4:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Is this "Texas" ebony the same as persimmon, or is it something completely different? I understood that persimmon is the only true ebony grown in N. America.

Alex
Author:  cphanna [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
If I could get big enough pieces, I would use it for back and side wood, and I would go more traditional with choices for top woods. Your smaller billet ought to be fine for fingerboards, face plates on head stocks, heel caps--even bridges. Then you could make tool handles out of the remaining scrap. Or soles for small planes. Etc., etc., etc. You've got the idea. I think you've got a real good score here.
Author:  Darryl Young [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Looks great!
Author:  Steve Kinnaird [ Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Alex Kleon wrote:
Is this "Texas" ebony the same as persimmon, or is it something completely different? I understood that persimmon is the only true ebony grown in N. America.

Alex


Chris is right, Alex, "T. Ebony" is an honorary title, as this is not a true ebony.
It's name is Pithecellobium flexicaule (I think that's reasonably close), and I've seen another species name listed on some lists.
I add that last point, because I've got two different-looking boards that were both labeled Texas ebony.

Here's a guitar built using a TE board that was truly black on the outside, but a dark reddish-brown inside. Found use as peghead overlay, fretboard and bridge.


Attachment:
forsale_09guitars_233.jpg



Steve
Author:  David Newton [ Thu Jun 30, 2011 3:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Thanks for that foreign naming Steve, I was wondering...

Mine looks and smells (when cutting) and looks like Pau Ferro, Bolivian Rosewood.
The picture is fresh cut, but on some of the older parts of the log, it is very reddish, like rust.
Author:  John Arnold [ Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Quote:
Is this "Texas" ebony the same as persimmon, or is it something completely different?

The common name of the tree is ebony blackbead, and it is a legume. The tree is gnarly, with a short trunk. It grows in the Rio Grande valley around Brownsville, and much of the wood on the market today was made available due to hurricane damage.
There is a bush called black persimmon or Texas persimmon, but it rarely gets large enough to yield any useful lumber. Common persimmon is mostly white or off-white sapwood, but it occasionally produces a small black or variegated heart.
Quote:
If I could get big enough pieces, I would use it for back and side wood,

I have a few pieces of TE that are large enough for backs and sides, but I generally don't prefer to use such a dense wood for guitar bodies.
Author:  David Newton [ Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Thanks for pointing me to this sellers wood, John.
This particular piece is a real dissappointment, as it is about half rot, and the other half full of cracks. You pays your money and takes your chance, I guess.
It really points out why we depend on wood cutters so much to take the waste, and sell us good wood at a higher price. I'll pay the up-charge any day.
I doubt good traditional rosewood and ebony has any fear of being replaced by Texas Ebony, though the emergence of $100-a-board Brazilian will make you scratch your head!
Author:  Stuart Gort [ Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
I was in a warehouse the other day and saw a load of Argentinian Brown Ebony and was curious so I sorted through it. There were maybe 60 8/4 boards in this lot...half of it perfectly quartersawn. It was clear, hard, even grained, and pretty cheap. I immediately thought of fretboards....except for the unappealing homogenous brown color.

I wonder if this stuff could be dyed black easily? It sure looked like it would polish up well but I've never done that and don't know if one can dye and polish...or polish then dye.

If you could make this stuff black and get it polished, it might be an good economic substitute for ebony.
Author:  Alexandru Marian [ Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Alternative wood, Texas Ebony
Looks like this Argentine thing could be a great tonewood. It is from the caesalpinia genus, same as pernambuco!
I don't think the uniform brown is such a problem. With some finger grime and oil, and frets and strings catching the eye, most might not even notice it is not ebony.
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