Todd Stock wrote:
I wet my linings for tight bends, but when i try it with my kerfings, they just end up a soggy mass of fine sawdust and water
Newbie might not understand that humorous post Todd.
| Official Luthiers Forum! http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/ |
|
| Wet your kerfing? http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=32140 |
Page 1 of 2 |
| Author: | Jeff T. [ Sun May 08, 2011 5:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Wet your kerfing? |
Hi everyone, I'm another newbie to your wonderful site and had a question that I would like answered by someone in the know. lately I've been wetting my kerfings and clamping them in the sides to dry, this way I can do a one piece kerfing per side instead of multiple pieces. when they dry they hold their shape and make it pretty easy to glue them in. My question is there a downside to doing this that I need to be aware of. |
|
| Author: | douglas ingram [ Sun May 08, 2011 6:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I don't know if there is a downside. It is the method that I've been using and I will keep on doing it that way, whether I do it in sections or full length pieces. It makes life a lot easier, just requires a little more planning. |
|
| Author: | bluescreek [ Sun May 08, 2011 6:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I often wet kerfing to help bending it |
|
| Author: | Mark Tripp [ Sun May 08, 2011 8:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Yep. I usually use reverse kerf Spanish Cedar, and wetting makes using it a snap. |
|
| Author: | Paul Burner [ Mon May 09, 2011 12:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Todd Stock wrote: I wet my linings for tight bends, but when i try it with my kerfings, they just end up a soggy mass of fine sawdust and water Newbie might not understand that humorous post Todd.
|
|
| Author: | theguitarwhisperer [ Mon May 09, 2011 12:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Robitussin DM helps with my kerfing. |
|
| Author: | the Padma [ Mon May 09, 2011 12:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Jeff, hate to see newbies made light of. But your profile say you a "semi pro" Makes me go hmmm... You see, a kerf is a cut. So kerfing is a verb meaning ~ to make a series of cuts. When you talk about installing wet kerfing, what you are saying is you are installing a pile of wet sawdust, cuz thats all thats left after the kurf has been cut...sawdust. In reality you are installing linings that have been kerfed. Is a common mistake and you even find big name loothier supply house selling "kerfing" and sides instead of kerfed linings and ribs, which is the proper name for what most peoples call sides. They are ribs, not sides and not all linings have been kurfed. Oh and no, I do not wet any of the wood used in the building process other than to wash off glue ooze ....not even when bending. blessings and welcome to the forum  Padma
|
|
| Author: | randys [ Mon May 09, 2011 1:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
the Padma wrote: Jeff, hate to see newbies made light of. But your profile say you a "semi pro" Makes me go hmmm... You see, a kerf is a cut. So kerfing is a verb meaning ~ to make a series of cuts. When you talk about installing wet kerfing, what you are saying is you are installing a pile of wet sawdust, cuz thats all thats left after the kurf has been cut...sawdust. In reality you are installing linings that have been kerfed. Is a common mistake and you even find big name loothier supply house selling "kerfing" and sides instead of kerfed linings and ribs, which is the proper name for what most peoples call sides. They are ribs, not sides and not all linings have been kurfed. Oh and no, I do not wet any of the wood used in the building process other than to wash off glue ooze ....not even when bending. blessings and welcome to the forum PadmaThank you, Padma. That explanation was useful and constructive. ![[:Y:]](./images/smilies/smiley20.gif "Thumbs Up")
|
|
| Author: | Alexandru Marian [ Mon May 09, 2011 6:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I found wetting doesn't help enough when dealing with tight curves like a small guitar has. Perhaps I did not wet them enough. Anyway, I switched to bending them on the pipe, resulting in zero breaks. |
|
| Author: | ChuckG [ Mon May 09, 2011 9:00 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I use Spanish Cedar reverse kerfed linings and they can be a bit brittle so I bend them in the Fox bender. It's really easy and doesn't really take any time away from the process as there is always something else to do while they cool in the bender. Haven't broken one in a long time - even in Venetian cutaways (shouldn't have said that - watch the next set snap like twigs!  ). Chuck |
|
| Author: | jac68984 [ Mon May 09, 2011 9:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I use reverse kerf linings and always wet (spritz with water and wrap in aluminum foil for about 15 min) them and clamp them to the outside of the sides the night before planing to install. Helps greatly to avoid breaks during installation. Aaron |
|
| Author: | JJ Donohue [ Mon May 09, 2011 11:03 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I bend all 4 on the Fox bender at the same time. Spritz 2 lengths of craft paper, sandwich the liners between, place between steel slats and heat blanket and bend till the reach 220*F for 10 minutes. Let them cool in place and in less than an hour they perfectly conform to the sides. I thank Charles Fox every time I use the bender for sides, binding and liners. |
|
| Author: | Jeff T. [ Mon May 09, 2011 7:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Thank you everyone for your responses and in correcting my terminology. I just got used to calling linings "kerfing",bad habit!!!! I've been a woodworker all my life, and just turned 53 so I'm not a newbie per say. I 'm on number six with my guitar builds and have sold three, so I listed myself as semi-pro. I know that I have a long way to go to consider myself a true luthier and this forum is the best place i have found to get answers that you can trust are right !!!!! I have been spying on here for the last year and found many answers to questions that I have had along my way to " luthierism" So Thank you all agian, you guys are my hero's.!!! ![[clap]](./images/smilies/smiley32.gif "adulations")
|
|
| Author: | WudWerkr [ Mon May 09, 2011 8:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
A rather loud explsion went off once and i wet my pants  , but ive never wet my kerfing !
|
|
| Author: | pvg [ Tue May 10, 2011 9:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
All due respect to the experts and linguists out there, but for decades back when there were guitar players and "mechanics", i.e. guitar repairmen- "luthiers" were a rare breed and most of us had never met one- the kerfed linings found in most guitars were indeed referred to as "kerfing." This was not due to ignorance; it was a useful way of referring to a specific part of the guitar's construction. Which is, after all, the point. Is it not? regards pvg |
|
| Author: | Tony_in_NYC [ Tue May 10, 2011 9:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I don't know Philip, I much prefer to get bogged down by pedantic discussions of linguistic correctness. Don't you? I am joking of course, as I believe Todd was as well. I think it is generally accepted that when people say, "I installed the kerfing" that what they mean is in fact, kerfed linings, and not a pile of saw dust. Todd has been very helpful to everyone on this forum, so I do not think he was being mean spirited when he made his joke. Just pedantic and funny. I am almost certain this post will be taken the wrong way by at least a few peopl who read it, but I am in no way implying that pvg is wrong in what he said, nor is Todd. We are all just messing around with a commonly misused term in the world of guitar building. If you will excuse me, I have bad cold and I just kerfed up lung over here. More importantly, I was kerfing so hard, I wet my pants. My kerfs remain dry. |
|
| Author: | SimonF [ Tue May 10, 2011 12:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Jeff, your terminology is correct. Kerfed lining was probably the original term used but "kerfing" is also technically correct --- but only within the field of lutherie. In general woodworking, kerfing refers to the actual "process" of putting kerfs (or cuts) into a piece of wood to make it flexible . In linguistic terms, it would likely fall under jargon but so is kerfed lining or solid lining -- which makes kerfing equally valid. The word kerfing is ubiquitous and instantly recognizable to guitar builders and that is why it is used so frequently. If one or two people used it then it wouldn't be jargon but when almost the entire population of builders use it then the situation is different. Don't trust everything these guys say 
|
|
| Author: | theguitarwhisperer [ Tue May 10, 2011 5:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I don't know, there's a certain snob appeal to refusing to call kerfing "kerfing", it makes you sound smarter and just a notch above the rest of the merely average luthiers out there (such as myself). It puts you "in the know". |
|
| Author: | CharlieT [ Tue May 10, 2011 5:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
theguitarwhisperer wrote: I don't know, there's a certain snob appeal to refusing to call kerfing "kerfing", it makes you sound smarter and just a notch above the rest of the merely average luthiers out there (such as myself). It puts you "in the know".
|
|
| Author: | klooker [ Tue May 10, 2011 5:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Sorry to perpetuate all this chatter that has no bearing on the original post, but in The Good Book of Cumpiano, chapter 9, it has a heading that says, "Step 2 - Gluing on the Kerfing". Kevin Looker |
|
| Author: | the Padma [ Tue May 10, 2011 7:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
theguitarwhisperer wrote: I don't know, there's a certain snob appeal to refusing to call kerfing "kerfing", it makes you sound smarter and just a notch above the rest of the merely average luthiers out there (such as myself). It puts you "in the know". Ah yes "in the know" eh! "Sound smarter and just a notch above" eh! Well here be some more stuff for you mere "average luthiers" to string up... Luthier: derived form lute. Origin: 1325–75; Middle English The language of terms used in our craft is quite ancient, well rather old to say the least. The purpose of this site is to learn from them that do know, as such there is no need to take the information being shared and label it as snob appeal. Now back on proper terminology for our craft. The technical words or labels are derived from the French and Italians but mainly from the English. Having been educated to speak in the Queens English, one finds your American bastardization of the English language appalling. However it must be overlooked with a touch of compassion for the simple reason that sadly, the United States of America does not have an Official Language to converse with. Now this is the "Official Luthiers Forum" yet no one can tell me who or what governing body had the authority to sanction it as such. Right. You would think with a title like "Official Luthiers Forum" that all you newbies and average luthiers are hanging around here asking questions to ummm well you know...learn the skills and the "Official" languageing of our ancient craft. Now if you just wanna make a few guitars may I most humbly suggest you go watch youtube videos. blessings Padma |
|
| Author: | theguitarwhisperer [ Tue May 10, 2011 8:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
I dunno, snob appeal is kind of, appealing.......  "Kerfing" is technically correct within the field of lutherie, and just because some have decided that the descriptive label ("kerfed linings") is the only correct way to refer to the kerfings (professional common usage, even by masters) doesn't mean that it's better. The purpose of this site is to learn from them that do know, not to label information as snob appeal....maybe....but it is not incorrect to call kerfing "kerfing", and newbies will get the idea that those in the know, the "Elite", so to speak, call them kerfed linings, and the shmoes call them "kerfing". Pointing out that certain usages, while being no more correct, have a certain snob appeal and therefore might be more desireable to use depending on your station, is ALSO information, and worthy of report on a forum. It is not derogatory in any way. |
|
| Author: | the Padma [ Tue May 10, 2011 8:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
As the skunk said to Bambi "You can call me Flower if you want."
|
|
| Author: | Jim Kirby [ Tue May 10, 2011 8:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
Oh no, another kerfing vs. kerfing thread again!  Fox bender here. I have zero success getting reverse kerf linings in without breaking if I don't pre-bend. (Of course that's just my noob lack of skills) For regular kerf linings, I like to break them just north of the waist anyway, so it's less of an issue. |
|
| Author: | the Padma [ Tue May 10, 2011 9:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Wet your kerfing? |
For regular kerf linings in tight curve areas...use the belt sander on the un kurfed side. well thats what me do. |
|
| Page 1 of 2 | All times are UTC - 5 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|