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Black Laquered Top
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=28282		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Tom Armstrong [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Black Laquered Top
Never done one but have a request for a black soundboard in a new commission. I have a personal build coming up so I thought I'd be the guinea pig. Anyone know the steps or know of a tutorial on the process? I'm stumped on the initial process. I know Joe White has done a couple for OLFers but I'd like to learn how for the future.
Thanks for any help.

Tom Armstrong
Author:  TonyKarol [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Well, if it were me doing it .. I would get down 4-5 coats of clear, and level those, then shoot the black, scrape binding purfling if necessary, then another 5-6 on top of that of clear, let cure, flat sand and buff. Make sure your prep snading is a flat as can be, because the gloss black will show every wave/dip/hump in a top ...
Author:  Tom Armstrong [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 3:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Tony,
Thanks but I can't get mind around how to protect the rosette/purfling and still have crisp lines.
Author:  James W B [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 5:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Hesh did a black top with a Tiger Myrtle back and sides that is sensational.I`ve even been lucky enough to play it.SWEET !!!! I`m sure he could help you.HESH?
James
Author:  Darrel Friesen [ Mon Jul 19, 2010 5:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
James W B wrote:
Hesh did a black top with a Tiger Myrtle back and sides that is sensational.I`ve even been lucky enough to play it.SWEET !!!! I`m sure he could help you.HESH?
James


I tried that before James. Joe White did the finishing on those. Very nice!
Author:  TonyKarol [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 7:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Its all in the masking and scraping back from the black to the clear underneath ... check the archives, or call Joe White .. they use a special automotive masking tape for the job
Author:  Dave Stewart [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
I did a blacktop using waterbased (USL) and Stewmacs black "pigment". Not an expert like Joe, just stormed through & it came out ok. I pre-dyed with black aniline dye on bare top but decided later that it probably wasn't necessary. I shellac-sealed, then a couple of coats of clear, then pigmented black lacquer, then clear overcoats. Tony's made some good points.... I'd add mask well INTO your decorative lines so the inevitable "ridge" created at the edge of the tape is scraped off as well. I scraped back about 1 hour after last black coat & it went very well because lacquer was still kind of soft.
I think one of the keys is a dark inside purfling line. I made sure when planning that the line nearest the wood was .020" black. That way you have an .020" buffer while scraping and the edge is alway sharp (because you're actually seeing the black purfling line rather than the paint edge).
Author:  Tom Armstrong [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 9:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Dave and Tony,
Thanks guys. That gives me about what I need to get started. I'll also call Joe and see if he can tell me what tape to use.

Tom
Author:  Parser [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 11:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Dave, that sure looks like expert work to me....!
Author:  Dave Stewart [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 11:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Thanks guys. Filippo, you may be right about the primer.... didn't hurt anyway & very little time to do it.
Author:  Tom Armstrong [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 12:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Thanks to all.
I finally found this in the archives: viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=20656&hilit=+masking+black
Author:  Josh H [ Tue Jul 20, 2010 1:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
A few other things I've discovered from working with colours. I always use a purfling scheme that has a black line on the inside. I tape off to the middle of that black purfling line. That way when I scrape the purfling clean I only have to scrape to the black purfling. It leaves a crisp line around the top. (I don't think that made any sense) :?

Also I seal the top with 2-3 coats and then spray the colour. I mix up toner that is 2 parts thinner to 1 part lac and add the colour to that. Then I'll spray 8-10 top coats (in two sessions). I always want to make sure I have enough clear on top so that I don't risk going through the finish when sanding and buffing. If you go through into the colour you might as well scrape it off and start again.

I'll also add that I hate working with black more than any other color. Everything shows up on black...

Josh
Author:  Hesh [ Wed Jul 21, 2010 3:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
Darrel Friesen wrote:
James W B wrote:
Hesh did a black top with a Tiger Myrtle back and sides that is sensational.I`ve even been lucky enough to play it.SWEET !!!! I`m sure he could help you.HESH?
James


I tried that before James. Joe White did the finishing on those. Very nice!


Just a bit of a correction here - Joe White did the dread that I completed this year and Tony Ferguson did the L-OO that kind of started this black top thing for me. Both finishes were beautifully done.
Author:  Tom Armstrong [ Fri Jul 23, 2010 8:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
My thanks to all that took the time to respond.

Tom
Author:  Fred Tellier [ Fri Jul 23, 2010 12:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Black Laquered Top
I took a tour of the Gibson Boseman plant and was surprised to see a bunch of workers scraping the finish off of binding and rosettes with glass microscope slides. These must be cheap to use, there were boxes of them everywhere.

Fred
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