| Official Luthiers Forum! http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/ |
|
| Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=27471 |
Page 1 of 1 |
| Author: | unkabob [ Wed May 19, 2010 7:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
My first guitar is a kasha-braced from Allied Lutherie plans. I have built a Kasha-braced baritone ukulele with good results. I feel uncomfortable building without a bridge-plate but that is what the plans call for. My question is what does somebody who has built one think about it. I am considering a 1/16" maple bridge-plate but I have no idea what that would do to the tone of the instrument. Any help would be appreciated. Bob 
|
|
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Wed May 19, 2010 9:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
I don't build Kasha braced systems, but I build classicals without a bridge plate. A properly glued bridge should give you all of the support you need. |
|
| Author: | JimWomack [ Thu May 20, 2010 6:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
In addition to adding strength at a critical area, a bridge plate also keeps the softer top wood from being chewed up by the string ball-ends. I think you need some kind of bridge plate, IMHO. |
|
| Author: | Oskar Strådal [ Thu May 20, 2010 7:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
JimWomack wrote: In addition to adding strength at a critical area, a bridge plate also keeps the softer top wood from being chewed up by the string ball-ends. I think you need some kind of bridge plate, IMHO. If I am not misstaken Kasha solved that problem by using a pinless bridge. |
|
| Author: | truckjohn [ Thu May 20, 2010 7:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
If I am not mistaken -- Kasha guitars were gut/nylon string "Classical" guitars rather than steel string.... Many nylon string instruments have designs without bridge plates.... Some do have a thin spruce bridge graft -- but I think they are more to help with thin tops bellying.... If you are building a steel string guitar with bridge pins -- it may be worth considering adding some sort of protection for the string ball ends. Thanks John |
|
| Author: | unkabob [ Thu May 20, 2010 9:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
Thankyou Your mixed replies reflect my problem exactly. Since nobody in my circle of friends plays a classical guitar but I prefer the sound, I have reduced the nut from 52mm to 44mm and I would like to be able to install light steel strings. I had a bouzouki soundboard crack this winter and I am a little gun-shy. I have decided to go with the maple bridge-plate and hope for the best. I am also considering using a ukulele-style knot and bead through the soundboard for tying off the strings. Thanks again for your help. Bob
|
|
| Author: | Tom West [ Thu May 20, 2010 10:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
Think Kline and Kauffman{hope spelling is correct} are both into Kasha type steel strings. Tom |
|
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Thu May 20, 2010 10:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
Now I take my answer back. A Kasha braced guitar is not designed for the pull of steel strings. Two things are going to be a problem. You have no central strengthening mechanism with a Kasha system. Even with "Silk & Steel" strings which some, not me, have put on classical guitars, you are adding about 40 to 60% additional pull to the top, and on a Kasha, the weakest part of the top, not the strongest. I think you are going to create some critical shear issues by the braces stopping at the bridge area, coming from all directions. Others may disagree with me. Just my take on the Kasha system. |
|
| Author: | enalnitram [ Thu May 20, 2010 11:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
WaddyThomson wrote: Now I take my answer back. A Kasha braced guitar is not designed for the pull of steel strings. Two things are going to be a problem. You have no central strengthening mechanism with a Kasha system. Even with "Silk & Steel" strings which some, not me, have put on classical guitars, you are adding about 40 to 60% additional pull to the top, and on a Kasha, the weakest part of the top, not the strongest. I think you are going to create some critical shear issues by the braces stopping at the bridge area, coming from all directions. Others may disagree with me. Just my take on the Kasha system. Steve Klein, Steven Kauffman, Max Krimmel, Jimmy Caldwell, Colin Kaminski, John Mello, Tom Bills, et al, have built Kasha braced steel strings. |
|
| Author: | JohnAbercrombie [ Thu May 20, 2010 12:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
My two cents worth.... It's not a question of 'Kasha bracing for steel-string' at all, but rather 'what happens if I use steel strings on a classical guitar?' If the plans are for a Kasha-Schneider classical, using steel strings is going to be a problem. As others have pointed out, there are many examples of 'Kasha-braced' steel string guitars- you can add the (ill-fated/short-lived) Gibson 'Mark" series guitars to the list. I built a 'Kasha' steel string in 1981 and it's still tuned up and holding together, though it doesn't get out of its case very often. BTW, I don't know much about Stewart/Stuart Adamson, the author of the Allied plans. I did buy some of his classical plans and found them to be quite 'generic'. There is quite a bit of Kasha info available in the GAL publications and elsewhere; might be worth some double-checking? Cheers John |
|
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Thu May 20, 2010 1:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
Sorry, I'm not familiar with the Kasha Steel String plans, but I see your's does have a bridge plate, and a bar at the bridge to provide rotational strength. |
|
| Author: | unkabob [ Thu May 20, 2010 2:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
John: Thankyou for posting that picture. It is useful to see what other people have built. I will investigate the GAL site. Waddy: I want the option to install steel strings, whether or not I exercise it or not. Whittling guitar braces. Bob
|
|
| Author: | JohnAbercrombie [ Thu May 20, 2010 2:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
unkabob wrote: John: Thankyou for posting that picture. It is useful to see what other people have built. I will investigate the GAL site. WaddyThomson wrote: Sorry, I'm not familiar with the Kasha Steel String plans, but I see your's does have a bridge plate, and a bar at the bridge to provide rotational strength. Just to be clear- that pic is of the Gibson Mark 53 bracing - it's an ebay 'project guitar'-you can see some 'added repair bits'. I don't have pics of the inside of the guitar I built- I recall I used info from GAL DataSheets as the resource for that one-it was pre-internet. Bob- You can use your browser's 'search' function (Ctrl-F) to search the GAL past publications at http://www.luth.org/al-content.htm The BigRedBooks are interesting, and a good resource, if you have the $$. Let's hope you get an answer to your main question, and find somebody who has built a guitar using the Stuart Adamson plans. Cheers John |
|
| Author: | Tom West [ Thu May 20, 2010 3:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
Bob: Sorry if I added any confusion.....! Sometimes I get caught up too much in peripheral ideas.Good luck in your quest. Tom |
|
| Author: | Jimmy Caldwell [ Thu May 20, 2010 3:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
Bob, I have built a half dozen or so Kasha-Klein braced steel strings. Quite a different animal than a classical if that's what you're interested. I do use a bridgeplate, but it's split over the lower transverse brace and is used in conjunction with a pinless bridge. (A misnomer because it actually has small steel pins that go all the way through the top and bridgeplate. Here are a few quick pics. Attachment: dmtb1.jpg Attachment: dmtg3.jpg Attachment: 2005-07-13_135342_sjbridge.jpg
|
|
| Author: | unkabob [ Thu May 20, 2010 8:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Kasha guitar, allied plans, Anyone built one? |
Jimmy: That is beautiful. If I want to the posibility of steel strings I will have to beef up the torque brace and that is likely to cost me in tone with classical strings. Maybe I will put off steel strings to my next build. Thanks for the help. Bob
|
|
| Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC - 5 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|