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harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=26348		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  John Lewis [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 12:25 am ]
Post subject:  harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
Does anyone know the minimum dimensions for harp guitar backs and sides? Does anyone sell back and sides for harp guitars or do most folks just resaw?

Thanks guys-
Author:  TonyKarol [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
If you are talking Dyer .. then the top/back need to be about 10-11 inches wide, and about 42 long .. Shane at High Mountain cuts tops to 48 ... as for back and sides, you most likely need ot find suitable boards and resaw them .. again, clsoe to 4 feet is required for the arm top, then two pieces for the bottom half and bottom arm, about 32 and 24 inches respectively, in the rough. As well, you will need either custom length binding, or spliced to make the top arm pieces ..
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
That sounds about right. Shane cuts my tops so I can do two piece tops. The back is a different story.

viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=26101&p=351919&hilit=harp+guitar#p351919

Mike
Author:  DennisK [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
The only place I've found with harp sized back/side sets is this: http://www.harpguitarmusic.com/listings/wood.htm

But since tops are relatively easy to come across, and backs aren't quite as structurally and acoustically important, I've been thinking about just using a normal guitar set for the back of the main body, and gluing on a second half of a normal back set for the back of the harp arm. You'd have to rotate the arm back piece to cover it with an 8-9 inch wide board though, but I think it might actually look better with a change of grain direction there.

For the sides, I'd graft at the waist on the bass side. With luck, you may be able to get by with only one extra side board, thus giving you two harp guitars from three normal back/side sets. One full board for bottom to neck on the treble side, half a board for bottom to waist on bass side, full board for waist to top of the harp arm bass side, and the other half board for treble side of the harp arm.

Of course, I'm still just starting on my first regular guitar, so while that is an idea, it is not necessarily a good one beehive
But hopefully some of the more experienced folks will chime in.

Oh, and of course another option would be to laminate. Long veneers are easy to find.
Author:  John Lewis [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
Thanks guys-

That was exactly what I was looking for! I have a bunch of 4/4 white limba boards that are the perfect size to resaw - those should work great.

Thanks again-
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
DennisK wrote:
The only place I've found with harp sized back/side sets is this: http://www.harpguitarmusic.com/listings/wood.htm


That is because Gregg Miner gets them from Shane. I buy mine directly from Shane since I have certain things I am asking for.

Mike
Author:  DennisK [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
Mike O'Melia wrote:
DennisK wrote:
The only place I've found with harp sized back/side sets is this: http://www.harpguitarmusic.com/listings/wood.htm


That is because Gregg Miner gets them from Shane. I buy mine directly from Shane since I have certain things I am asking for.

Mike

Shane only cuts spruce and cedar though, right? Or can his EIR supplier provide harp sized sets too? I'll definitely be going to him for tops, but back/side sets are a lot harder to come by, especially without resawing equipment.
Author:  TonyKarol [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 5:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
Not sure whether you can get EIrw that way .. most suppliers are cutting the sets in India, there are few boards I have ever seen that are wide enough to resaw for a harp ... that said, if you 4 pieced it, it would work with stuff I have seen. They probably arent interested in cutting up 2 sets vs the 1000's of regular guitar sets. They would have to cut the log totally different just to get the required length I imagine.

IMO ... You need to go to a supplier who is actually resawing the boards here in north america, like Bob Cefalu at RC, or in Canada at A&M or Exotic. Tell them what you are after, and then they can see if they have suitable boards to resaw into sets.
Author:  Shane Neifer [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
To date I have only saw top sets for harps. Greg doesn't get tops from me, I am not sure of his supplier but Greg is good people! I have Honduras Mahogany that I can make harp sets from and I have not asked my EIR supplier in India for harp sets before but I could if there was an interest. I have them putting together an order for me right now so if there is some interest I will get them to add a few harp sets to it.

Shane
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 9:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
Oops! First, I thought we were talking about tops only, but I see that was not the case. Second, it was a phone conversation with Gregg that led me to believe the tops at HG.net were from Shane. None the less, Shane is a great harp top supplier! Love that lutz. As for the b&s sets, I found someone here who was willing to resaw from large billets.
Sorry for the confusion.
Mike
Author:  DennisK [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
Shane Neifer wrote:
I have Honduras Mahogany that I can make harp sets from and I have not asked my EIR supplier in India for harp sets before but I could if there was an interest. I have them putting together an order for me right now so if there is some interest I will get them to add a few harp sets to it.

I'm still a little bit on the fence, but I would most likely be in for two EIR harp sets if they are being cut. Like I said, I am just starting out, plus my current wood storage area is barely wide enough for regular guitar sides. But I'm sure I could find a space, and I could always sell them later if I change my mind on building.

On another note, you wouldn't happen to have a single monstrous spruce board lying around would you? Something around 56 inches long and 10 wide, give or take a few. One of my future projects is what I call the piano harp guitar, which is basically a guitar with regular harp arm, plus about 12 inches added off the tail end of the body. Going on the concept that pianos just get longer and longer to improve bass clarity, but not any wider. So why not try the same concept on a guitar? The design is still in early stages though and won't be finalized until after I've built at least one regular harp guitar, which won't be until after the first one or two regular guitars... so I don't really need to gather materials for quite a while, but might as well check.
Author:  Shane Neifer [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
DennisK wrote:
Shane Neifer wrote:
I have Honduras Mahogany that I can make harp sets from and I have not asked my EIR supplier in India for harp sets before but I could if there was an interest. I have them putting together an order for me right now so if there is some interest I will get them to add a few harp sets to it.

I'm still a little bit on the fence, but I would most likely be in for two EIR harp sets if they are being cut. Like I said, I am just starting out, plus my current wood storage area is barely wide enough for regular guitar sides. But I'm sure I could find a space, and I could always sell them later if I change my mind on building.

On another note, you wouldn't happen to have a single monstrous spruce board lying around would you? Something around 56 inches long and 10 wide, give or take a few. One of my future projects is what I call the piano harp guitar, which is basically a guitar with regular harp arm, plus about 12 inches added off the tail end of the body. Going on the concept that pianos just get longer and longer to improve bass clarity, but not any wider. So why not try the same concept on a guitar? The design is still in early stages though and won't be finalized until after I've built at least one regular harp guitar, which won't be until after the first one or two regular guitars... so I don't really need to gather materials for quite a while, but might as well check.


Dennis just give me a heads up as you get closer to thinking this a good idea and I will cut something up for you that will work. I will wait to see if there are any other EIR interests before I committ to ordering a few sets. But again, I only order every 18 months or so so if I don't order soon it will be a while before I order again.

Shane
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 11:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
What the heck is a piano harp guitar? Shane, I will make the EIR deal worth ur while. 4 sets, good figure, and to my size requirements which you prolly know. :-)
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Thu Mar 04, 2010 11:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
I should add that I do not mind three piecing the back given that the wood has marked figure. Shane, I will send dimensions.
Author:  Shane Neifer [ Fri Mar 05, 2010 1:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
This might help you out a bit John. I just measured the Dyer plans and I get the sides at 5 x 49.5 and the backs 10 x 42. That leaves some room for glue ups. So I just sent an e-mail to supplier in India to see if they can supply me 10 sets and to see what the price will be. I will let you all know what the response is and I will post in another thread (sorry john for the hijack.....) with the results.

Shane
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
DennisK wrote:
One of my future projects is what I call the piano harp guitar, which is basically a guitar with regular harp arm, plus about 12 inches added off the tail end of the body. Going on the concept that pianos just get longer and longer to improve bass clarity, but not any wider. So why not try the same concept on a guitar?


I reread this and finally understand that you invented the term "harp guitar piano". I thought the reason the strings get progressively longer in a piano as the notes get lower has something to do with tension and wavelength. There are harp guitars that use heavier gauge strings than I am currently using, but I am not sure what you are talking about will result in a clearer sound. I guess you already have been over at harpguitars.net? That would be the place to ask questions... nothing new under the sun there regarding harp guitars. What about a longer harp arm?

Mike

PS: I watched Mythbusters last night. There is this idea that grand pianos can explode in a fire. They can be under as much as 40,000 pounds of tension when fully tuned. Myth was false. But that is a lot of tension!
Author:  DennisK [ Tue Mar 09, 2010 1:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: harp guitar tonewood dimensions?
Mike O'Melia wrote:
I reread this and finally understand that you invented the term "harp guitar piano".

Haha, yeah, I just made that up based on the origin of the idea. Anyway, I made a new topic for this so as not to derail this thread any further: http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=26424
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