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| EXP 23 baritone strings, .022 5th string tone http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=26044 |
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| Author: | Burton LeGeyt [ Sat Feb 13, 2010 11:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | EXP 23 baritone strings, .022 5th string tone |
Hi everyone, I have had my first baritone strung up now for a week or so and I am noticing that the 5th string, F# in B-B (the .o22 unwound string in the EXP23 D'addario set) has a different tone than the other strings. As the guitar settles in it becomes a little less obvious but I notice it and it really messes with how I feel playing the guitar. Has anyone else noticed this? It feels like a pretty thick unwound string and I am attributing that to the difference but maybe someone else has a suggestion or experience here. I am thinking aboiut either trying a smaller diameter unwound string or going with the same diameter wound string. Thanks for any help you guys can give. If many of you have built baritones before and not noticed this I would love to hear from you too. If it is something else that is happening I would actually be pysched, it would just mean some extra-fine sleuthing to find the culprit spot. |
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| Author: | Laurent Brondel [ Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EXP 23 baritone strings, .022 5th string tone |
Burton, you should try a wound .022". In my electric days when I used to play in various slacked tunings I used an unwound .020" for the G and was never satisfied by either the tone, or the accuracy. .022" unwound seems it would make it hard to play in tune, and too aggressive tonally. |
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| Author: | dberkowitz [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 5:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EXP 23 baritone strings, .022 5th string tone |
With about 30% of my annual production in baritones, this subject comes up often. What I find interesting is that subconsciously no one seems to notice the difference in presentation from wound to unwound on regular guitars with the same regularity as they do on baritones. Most often this is on the 6th string that on full scale baritones is double wound and as such has a rounder presentation than the other strings -- its also halfway to a bass and should be beginning to have that presentation. In your instance, my first question is whether this baritone you are using is one you built or by someone else or production. The EXP23's were designed to go on a 29" scale, so their presentation isn't balanced for other scale lengths. People tend to use the set because its the closest thing to a set of baritone strings, but that doesn't mean its the best choice. So what is the scale length of your baritone? Is there a difference in output between the 3rd and 2nd string as well? How is the overall string to string balance on the guitar? If the sclae length is anything but a 29" scale then, adjustments are necessary. I highly recommend against the .022" wound string. The problem here is that it has a very small core wire and will be prone to breakage. You'll also need a new saddle with it because it won't intonate in the same place as your unwound. I'd try going down to a plain .020" or perhaps a .019" to get that string to stop shouting at you. By lowering the tension you'll alleviate the difference between the adjacent strings. I'd need more information to give you a more complete answer in particular: Scale length, and how the string to string balance is for all strings, not just the 2nd string. I suspect its not entirely balanced elsewhere as well as the 2nd string. Finally, there are noticeable differences in presentation between the wound and unwound strings on any guitar. Some of these are native to the instrument, some can be string balance problems, i.e., not the best set of strings for that guitar, and sometimes its that the guitar has a "wolf" note, a note that shouts out more than others and it is this that contributes to the problem. Often that note is problematic not only in the open position, but elsewhere as well, but not always. |
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| Author: | TonyKarol [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EXP 23 baritone strings, .022 5th string tone |
I think they were designed to go on a 29.75 scale. . thats the scale of the tension listed on the packaging ... |
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| Author: | Burton LeGeyt [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EXP 23 baritone strings, .022 5th string tone |
Thanks for your answers guys. To fill in some info it is one that I built (my first baritone) and it has a 28.5 scale length. I have it tuned B-B in standard interval. Over the past few days as it has been playing in the differences in strings seems to have softened somewhat but is still present. Interestingly, It does seem to matter how the string is played also. Played inconsistently, that .022 string will not sustain the same as the .016 string, especially up the neck. I thought it could be a problem at the saddle and adjusted the break point but that didn't seem to be the problem. In the open note and first few positions if you are not sensitive to it it really can honk at you. David, your advice about the wolf note may be right on. I am hearing that note as right around G, which seems high for a baritone but would affect that F# open string. That could be compounding the problem. If that is most of the problem then it should soften as the guitar breaks in or I can go in later and lower the top a bit to lessen it. I do notice the difference in the low string but it doesn't bother me nearly as much. That difference sounds natural while the unwound string stands out in an annoying way. I may try a thinner string and see how that affects it. The balance between all of the other strings is fine, not amazing, but not problematic. On my regular guitars I don't notice a difference between the wound and unwound strings. I had a few guitars where there was one but it turned out to be inconsistencies by me in the nut and saddle and once remedied the balance was restored. That certainly could still be the case here but I have done all I know how to do to fix it and it still persists. |
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| Author: | dberkowitz [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: EXP 23 baritone strings, .022 5th string tone |
On my 28.59" scale bari, I use a 23p for the 2nd string. |
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