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Tools - Where to find a good rule?
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Author:  justink [ Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Tools - Where to find a good rule?
I guys.

I'm about to start #2 and I need to buy a good steel rule (my 1st build turned out well with a tape measure and a 6" calipers, but I think it is a bit ridiculous to use again)

I have read (cumpiano) that a 30-36" rigid rule with 1/64" and 1/100"s is best. But, I can't find any one who carries such a ruler. I know Starrett makes them, but where do you get them? And how much should I be expecting to pay?

Thanks Guys!
Author:  letseatpaste [ Tue Feb 09, 2010 10:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
I really like the Woodcraft 3-rule set (6", 12". 24"). Doesn't have 1/100's, though. That little 6" one comes in especially handy. (edit: they do have a 36" but it is pretty pricey, I haven't really had need for one that long yet, but I haven't done a ton of set up work, saddle slotting, etc.. yet)

http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/200044 ... r-Set.aspx
Image

This is my new favorite measuring tool... I got the 3" version of this from another place just to get my total purchase up so I could get free shipping. It came in real handy the other night to mark center lines around a neck blank, I always get one edge of the neck blank nice and flat and use it as a reference. Makes it real easy to mark the centerline down your headstock, at the bottom of the heel, etc... I might have to think about picking up one or two of the longer versions.

http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/200044 ... le--6.aspx
Image
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Tue Feb 09, 2010 11:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Where can you get good metric rules? All I can seem to find are Inch/Metric. I hate them. They are so confusing.
Author:  MRS [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
I actually prefer my straight edges that i bought at Hartville tool over my rules anymore. They have a 1/64th inch scale ruler on the bevel.
http://www.hartvilletool.com/product/13575
Author:  Terence Kennedy [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Think seriously about a ruler with decimal markings. Since I went this route I almost never use my fractional rulers.
Terry
Author:  Rene [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Here you go, MSC Industrial Supply.
I bought the satin finish SPI rules they are very good and lots cheaper than starrett's.

http://www1.mscdirect.com/Steel-Rules/R ... 01463.HTML

While you are there, get yourself a decimal equivalents, mm's, tap & screw size wall chart if you don't have one. It will come in handy. $4.00.

http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT?PM ... O=79492604

René
Author:  Tim L [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
+1 on MSC

Ask for their catalog. Not only does it work as a good weight for flattening warped plates but you will find things you never knew existed.

I like Starrett scales as the lines are fine and easy to read and split under a loupe.
Author:  Alexandru Marian [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 7:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Hida should have good quality metric Japanese rules.
Author:  justink [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Thank you all for the excellent advice!!

I want a 30-36" rule for both the fret layout and bridge placement. I will definitely have to check Ebay out as I have had pretty good luck on there before. But, SPI rules from MSC or ENCO look good also with the 1/10, 1/100 and 1/32, 1/64 graduations.

But, the Hartville 36" straight edge with 1/64 rule looks perfect! I will have to think about whether to just spend the $60-$70 on new one, or take a chance on Ebay with a nice Starrett.

Thanks all again for the help!
Author:  Todd Rose [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
I really like my Incra flexible steel rules - 12" &18", as well as my little rigid 6" rules. I also use my Incra 12" center finding rule a lot. I have a 24" rule that's handy sometimes. I never use a 36" rule, though I do have a 48" graduated straightedge that I use occasionally. For frets, I use fretting templates, and for bridge placement, I'm always measuring from the 12th fret.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx ... 3513,58883
Author:  justink [ Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Ahhh, So that's your trick, Todd! :)

I was measuring from the nut to place the bridge which make me think I needed a 25.4"+ rule to do this. But, if I measure from 12th, (or 14th for me = body) then that makes it a lot easier and I don't really need the 30"-36" rule.

So, now I need a straight edge and a 18" or 24" rule. Do I get them as one unit? - Hartsville graduated straight edge, or buy a straight edge and another rule for layout?
Author:  JohnAbercrombie [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 1:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
justink wrote:
I don't really need the 30"-36" rule.

Correct
justink wrote:
So, now I need a straight edge and a 18" or 24" rule. Do I get them as one unit? - Hartsville graduated straight edge, or buy a straight edge and another rule for layout?


I would keep the 'precision straightedge' tool separate from the rule.
Straightedge
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=50074&cat=1,240,45313
You want to protect that straightedge - ding it and it's not so useful!
Rules- Starrett as mentioned above or something cheaper but perfectly adequate:
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=32568&cat=1,43513

or go metric, when you get tired of dividing fractions in your head.

There are not many times when you really need to measure large-ish dimensions very accurately in guitar-building - even the bridge placement can be figured out by making a jig with your fingerboard or fret placement template, etc.

For thicknessing and working with smaller components, I find a cheap digital caliper to be useful.

Cheers
John
Author:  Todd Rose [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
justink wrote:
But, if I measure from 12th, (or 14th for me = body)


Measure from the 12th, not the 14th. Where the neck joins the body is irrelevant. The 12th is half the scale length. (Then add your compensation, of course). Or use a saddlematic.
Author:  justink [ Thu Feb 11, 2010 1:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Ahh, thank you Todd R! I just can't help but show off my lack of experience. Oh well :)

And thank you also Todd S for that great little bit on measuring! I come from a engineering background and we always used 1/1000 for everything, so it is not a big deal to think in 1/100s or measure in 1/1000 with a good dial calipers. I am still getting used to 1/64s and what not.

Thanks all!!

I think the route I may go (i thought this up as I lay in bed last night) is to get me a cosmetic second Starrett 24" rule off Ebay that looks good, and order some Precision ground O1 tool steel bar stock from McMaster Car for like $38 (36" x 2" x 3/16") and have both needs for around the same $80 or so that I would pay for a Made in China straight edge. The McMaster stock is not quite as accurate (ground to .005" over 36") but I think that will suffice. That way, if it doesn't work out, I can just use it for plane irons later.
Author:  Ken Mitchell [ Fri Feb 12, 2010 6:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Justin,

You may also want to look into getting a good center-finding ruler. I use mine ALL the time!

http://www.woodcraft.com/Family/2000444 ... Rules.aspx
Author:  Todd Rose [ Sat Feb 13, 2010 5:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Ken Mitchell wrote:
Justin,

You may also want to look into getting a good center-finding ruler. I use mine ALL the time!


I highly recommend the Incra. http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=2096

I'm going to get one of those Incra T-Rules also.
Author:  Mike Collins [ Sat Feb 13, 2010 6:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Metric rules at www.hmsenterprises.com

mc
Author:  EOArnie [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 9:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Lee Valley hasn't been mentioned yet, although they don't appear to have a 36" rule.

They have treated me right over the years, and are solid folks to deal with. They have a decent selection of quality rules here:

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&cat=1&p=43513
Author:  Eric Reid [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 11:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
I think the route I may go (i thought this up as I lay in bed last night) is to get me a cosmetic second Starrett 24" rule off Ebay that looks good, and order some Precision ground O1 tool steel bar stock from McMaster Car for like $38 (36" x 2" x 3/16") and have both needs for around the same $80 or so that I would pay for a Made in China straight edge. The McMaster stock is not quite as accurate (ground to .005" over 36") but I think that will suffice. That way, if it doesn't work out, I can just use it for plane irons later.[/quote]

I don't think you'll find the bar stock to be an adequate straightedge. It's accurate to .005" in width, not straightness. It comes annealed, so you'll have to harden and temper it before you use it for plane irons. (I think you knew that.) For checking frets, you'll save a lot of headaches if you buy McMaster's part # 2265A13 (24" tool steel straightedge--accuracy .001") Trying to dial in a few thousandths relief with a tool that has 3-5 thousandths inaccuracy (like the better straight edges in the luthier supply catalogs) will have you chasing your tail all day.
Author:  Tim L [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
IMHO you would be better off spending the dough for a good straight edge. If you are going to use it as a reference you are better off having something that is a known value. My straight edge is a thin cross section and hardened and ground. Tool steel, even though it is nicely finished, is not hardened and ground. If you do wind up using raw tool steel, good A1 or A2 will usually be closer spec than O1 and will move less after hardening plus it quenches in air. A bit more expernsive, but better stuff.

Years ago guys that were retiring would bring whole boxes by my shop to sell. Some were trying to get as much as possible out of what they had. Others just wanted to see the stuff go to someone who would use it. Also saw, and still see some in garage sales, flea markets, estate sales. I picked up whole boxes from a couple of guys at very reasonable prices. Most of the measuring tools are old, but useable. If you can find something like that you will not only wind up with a few scales and measuring tools, but will get some nice blocks and staging fixtures that are adaptable to everyday use.

Tim
Author:  Darryl Young [ Mon Feb 15, 2010 1:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools - Where to find a good rule?
Letseatpaste, thanks for that link to the Incra T-square rulers.....neat idea and I just ordered the 6" and 12" versions.
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