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level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=25700		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  ayavner [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 6:48 pm ]
Post subject:  level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
Was reading the instructions on a can of Behlen stringed instrument lacquer and was surprised to see that one of the steps was to level sand using wetordry paper and Mineral Spirits (instead of just water with a drop of soap)!

Has anyone here done that? Is it necessary, do you think, or can I just use water? I dont really like working with mineral spirits, and I can't imagine the smell wouldn't linger for years. Not to mention, would it dry cleanly or does it leave a residue?

I am sure the folks at Behlen know their product, but I wondered if there might be some caveats with that. If all else fails, I can call their hotline and ask, but thought I would see what the consensus is here for our application.

Adam
Author:  TonyKarol [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
I use it to wetsand .. especially on tops. Back and sides seem to be better at resisting swelling from water if wetsanding if you happen to sand thru. Tops .. well not so much. It almost always happens at binding/purfling areas, and the water/soap will get into the seam and swell stuff, causing grief for future finish coats ..

mineral spirits also dont seem to let the paper load like soapy water can (and I use a fair amount of Murphys when I water wet sand too).

I just put on nitrile gloves and go at it ...

Now I am not currently using Behlens .. but I have, and its fine. The remaining residue (mostly sanded finish solids, thats what is white) wipes off, and doesnt leave stains or anything. The finsih will polish up fine.
Author:  bluescreek [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
absolutely. Water can cause clouding in lacquer though I do admit to using it myself. If the lacquer is well cured it is ok. Mineral spirits does a great job for acting as the lubricant for level sanding.
No residue like soap .
Author:  Kelby [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
I've done it both ways, and haven't had problems with either one.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
Mineral spirits work great for wet-sanding Emtech 6000. I haven't tried it on anything else.
Author:  ayavner [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
Great! learned something new! I guess I always just thought of it as something to clean brushes with.

I'll give this a try asap! Any caveats (other than no naked flames lol)

adam
Author:  David Malicky [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
Not sure if you know about "odorless mineral spirits" -- a lot better, at least to my nose.
Author:  Tim McKnight [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
It also works on FP shellac too.
Author:  woody b [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
I use it wet sanding epifanes varnish.
Author:  Mike Kroening [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
Mineral spirits is one of those products that is compatible with just about every finish, just as shellac is a great base coat/seal coat under most finishes. Most times it works only when the finish is hard. So using it as a lubricant is great for sanding with lacquer, poly, shellac, varnish, and the list goes on. I've used this for many, many years as my lube for wet sanding never a problem unless you try to add finish before it dries. Otherwise all is good. once dry do a rub out with a clean paper towel and put on another coat of finish if needed. :)

BtW I do hope you all know that a brown paper bag wadded up and made soft is equivalent to about 20000 grit paper and a paper towel is about 30K? So after your next buffing job . Try hand rubbing it out again with a paper towel almost to a burnish, you might be surprised :)

Mike
Author:  ayavner [ Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
What kind of paper towel? Surely not those raspy ones like in gas station restrooms?

Can you recommend a type or brand? Sounds interesting!
Author:  SteveSmith [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 7:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
david82282 wrote:
Not sure if you know about "odorless mineral spirits" -- a lot better, at least to my nose.


[:Y:] [:Y:]
Author:  John A [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 7:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
and toilet paper is about 40,000 grit - Charmin which is softer will be 50,000 grit :D
Author:  ayavner [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 8:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
John A wrote:
and toilet paper is about 40,000 grit - Charmin which is softer will be 50,000 grit :D



Which reminds me, I hear they're coming out with a new paste wax. Comes in a convenient tube!

laughing6-hehe
Author:  Corky Long [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 8:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
ayavner wrote:
John A wrote:
and toilet paper is about 40,000 grit - Charmin which is softer will be 50,000 grit :D



Which reminds me, I hear they're coming out with a new paste wax. Comes in a convenient tube!

laughing6-hehe


So that's what I've been buffing with!! Need a mirror to see what kind of a shine I'm getting though. laughing6-hehe
Author:  jsimpson [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 9:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
SteveSmith wrote:
Mineral spirits work great for wet-sanding Emtech 6000. I haven't tried it on anything else.


I too use EmTech 6000. Tha was going to be my question, thanks Steve!
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 9:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
SteveSmith wrote:
Mineral spirits work great for wet-sanding Emtech 6000. I haven't tried it on anything else.



Really?? That's good to know, I was about to ask that. Thanks!
Author:  Mike Kroening [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
ayavner wrote:
What kind of paper towel? Surely not those raspy ones like in gas station restrooms?

Can you recommend a type or brand? Sounds interesting!
I use bounty :) I learned this trick from a friend that studied under Tage Frid.
mk
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
I would like to thank the OP for this great idea. I tried it out and it works GREAT on EmTech 6000.

I am not sure what "mineral spirits" is, it seems very low on the volitility scale, and as for minerals, no rocks in mine... but it does lube the paper well and no clogging!

Mike
Author:  npalen [ Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
Not sure if you guys are talking about sanding the final coats or level sanding the preliminary coats but would like to suggest 3M Frecut Gold paper which I believe goes up to P600. It eliminates the need for lubricant such as water or mineral spirits and the associated problems. Even a dry paper towel will quickly wipe off the sanding dust and it's much easier to see your progress than when stopping to wipe off the "wet dust". I dry sand preliminary leveling coats with P220 and P320 Gold and sand the final coats wet with P1500 and P2000 before buffing after a 4 week cure on the nitro.
I thank Barry Daniels for putting me on to the Gold paper. It simply does not load up on nitro and cuts fast.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Fri Jan 29, 2010 9:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: level sanding with mineral spirits... really??
I agree the gold is nice. I dry-sand up to 600 then start wet-sanding with the mineral spirits from there.
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