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Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?
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Author:  tcwave [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:57 am ]
Post subject:  Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?

Hi Guys,

I am creating a flamed maple neck and i have enough wood to create a one piece neck (meaning the heelblock, headpiece, and neck would all be a single piece of wood) The grain will run parallel to the neck.

In terms of strength, will this be as strong as a neck with a stacked heelblock and kerfed headpiece? Asthetically, I would prefer the entire neck be from a single slab of maple, but don't want to comprimise strength. What do you do?

In the book, Guitarmaking: Tradition and Technology by William Cumpiano and Johnathan Natelson, they say "the joined (3 piece)headstock is structurally sounder becuase of it's grain orientation. By avoiding a short grained headstock, the builder reduces the likelihood of fracture due to shock."

Best regards,
Ted

Author:  Mike Mahar [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?

There are thousands of single piece necks out there and their strength is more than adequate for a guitar. I use a scarf headstock and a stacked heel because it uses less (and often cheaper) lumber but I don't think a flamed maple neck with a stacked heel would look very good. Remember you can get two necks from a single block so even a single piece neck isn't really all that wasteful of wood.

Author:  David Newton [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?

You should make it one piece, of course.

I am probably the only one who would cut up a one-piece neck block, which usually can make two necks, into cuts that will make 3 necks, I'm so tight.

The issue is at the neck-shaft / head-stock transition, where the grain gets "short" when it doesn't turn with the turn of the head.
Lots of builders make a "volute" there, which is usually called cosmetic, but has a structural application. You may also inlet carbon fiber bars that cross the transition and reinforce it.

At the heel end, a dowel set into the heel, fretboard to heel cap, can reinforce against cracking across the grain.

Author:  Jeff Highland [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 4:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?

A lot of the bad press for one piece necks comes from experience with gibsons.
The earlier ones had a 16 degree headstock angle and this was a bad idea for short grain
But the worst detail was the huge recess cut for trussrod nut access.
The only good detail on these is the straight grain ears glue on the sides of the headstock.
Using a 14 deg angle and a small truss rod access (for an Allied rod allen key for example)makes the transition area much stronger.
A scarf joint is not necessarily a guarantee against short grain in the transition area.(depending on how you set it up)
Many I have seen end up with the scarf starting up around the first set of tuner holes. so you still have the short grain in the vulnerable area near the nut.

Author:  Tom West [ Tue Sep 08, 2009 4:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neck: Single piece or stacked heel block: Strength?

Many folks put an overlay on the back of the head stock.Looks classy and gives extra strength. The cf set in the headstock is an excellent idea or use something like ebony. Lots of guitars out there without any extra support.The worst culprit in my mind is truss rod adjustment at the headstock.

Author:  truckjohn [ Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?

David Newton wrote:
At the heel end, a dowel set into the heel, fretboard to heel cap, can reinforce against cracking across the grain.


I have had trouble with dowels -- they always end up expanding/contracting differently than the wood they are put into.... they can punch other glue joints loose and end up separating otherwise nicely fitted parts...

Granted... this isn't a cuttingboard where it will be immersed in Hot Water...

So far, plain 'ole Preparation and attention to getting a properly jointed fit and proper clamping haven't done me wrong.

YMMV

Good luck

John

Author:  george wilson [ Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?

I've made hundreds of guitars with scarf joints. Never had one fail. I did repair a Kohno classical where the joint failed,rather messily. I don't know it it was dropped,or what. The reglue stayed put o.k..

Author:  george wilson [ Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Neck: Single piece or stacked heelblock: Strength?

I should add that I've repaired many more broken peghead breaks that did NOT have a scarf joint.. Thin necks,big trussrod wells. Do they think we need to get in there with a Mack truck lug wrench,or what?

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